Do you want BATTERY 5?
Comments
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Take a look here for a start:
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Add to this: "In kit preview" in B4 (which actually is no preview anymore) only allows you to listen "with parameters", so you can't listen to just the raw sample whereas in B3 you could toggle between the 2 options.
Battery 3 also had a nicely sorted cell library. In general, it's a sample library with all playback parameters applied. Plus, it came nicely organized in folders. Now, with B4, you can still create a cell library if you wanted (using the "save cell" function), but it doesn't come with a library anymore.
Also, most of the kits B3 came with where at least halfway GM oriented. Which means you could as well replace one kit with another at least for a quick check. Or have Superior/EZ Drummer, Jamsticks or Logic's Drummer play through them. Pretty much not possible with the B4 kits anymore as, apart from kicks and snares, the mappings are pretty much randomized. It's fine to have such kits (they existed in B3 already as well), but I want a mixture of both. B4 only comes with kits pretty much sounding like "ah, let's mass drop some samples here". No love went into the creation of this library at all. Not even one single real drum kit, either (B3 had some).
Further, the B3 file browser had a tree open/collapse structure, which made navigating between files a whole lot easier. And the favourites function was actually useful as it added a folder to the browser rather than just a kinda tag. But it's pretty wellknown that NI can't do browsers, not at all.
___Talking about browsers: If you can't do them (which IMO is one of the biggest shortcomings in any NI product), why not use what the computer OS has on offer?
For instance: With Battery 2 (yes, I was using that, too - and even Battery 1), the sample browser was an "open" file window using the respective OS file browsers (Explorer/Win, Finder/Mac). Which was just excellent. Unlike the NI browsers you can size them as large as you want, and especially with truckloads of samples, it's just fantastic to drag the browser window so it covers your entire screen instead of aquiring SIMP (scrollwheel induced middlefinger paralysis), which is the common thing in NI land.
___
IMO it's about time for NI to realize all these things - which partially don't only exist in Battery. For instance, their file browsers are every bit as bad in each of their plugins and they're only getting away with it because people have no alternatives to, say, Kontakt.
But what about NI? Instead of listening to their experienced users or testers, they just release a flop and then abandon the product entirely, even in case it had huge potential (such as especially Battery - which is not yet officially abandoned but as good as dead already).
I mean, literally noone of their existing users or testers wanted a new Battery version to be like this thing here (I know this for a fact…). They wanted Battery 3 on stereoids, with some additional functions (such as loop slicing), some improved items (such as new filter models) and maybe some light retouching on the UI (I remember a resizeable browser to be one very understandable wish…). But they came up with B4. Which, apart from somewhat improved FX, has exactly no (!) improvements over B3.
This is just not how you properly deal with your products. And as said, NI is only surviving because they managed to establish Kontakt as a sort of de facto standard in software sampler land. Otherwise they'd likely be dead since a long time already.
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I read about 1/8th of your "yes, I know PE ruins everything it touches BUT" spiel and gave up. I am not a capitalist, and so when you argue in a way that is designed to cause resignation in people who accept those economics, that just isnt me. I dont resign myself to economics that amount to, in so many words, parasitism. These investors don't add value to anything- a point upon which we agree - they only siphon value, disrupt communities, and ultimately destroy the things we all enjoy in order to profit a tiny group of parasites - as its been for 1000 years or so in one form or another.
My eyes came to rest on this gem, and so I thought I would just leave it here:
"Yeah, I'm riding with Native. So let's saddle up, we've got a long way
to go, and a horse is only good for about 15 miles each day."Saddle up, pardner. That was one of the most awkward brand promotion statements anyone has ever made to me. Thanks.
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Thanks, @Milkman!
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Correct.
They are leaning into ecosystems within their product line that drive revenue, like Kontakt and NKS.
Battery 4 is redundant in the overall market, so I don't think corporate direction is a huge factor - outside of them simply thinking with their heads instead of their hearts.
Drum Samplers have become "stock." Most DAWs ship with a decent Drum Sampler in the box, some excellent. Others that don't, sometimes have Multi-Samplers that can get the job done without having to use anything else (Independence Proe.g.), as they have the necessary controls to do whatever tweaking you'd need to do. In some cases, they're even better than Battery 4 due to its feature set being in stasis for a decade.
Battery 4 released over a decade ago. The entire landscape was much different back then. It was inherently far more valuable a tool back then than it is now, and more worth investing in as a product (from the end-user's PoV). In 2024, that is not the case. Any investment they make in the product has to be justified with a performance expectation in 2024, not 2013.
Their synths have the same issue, and so does REAKTOR.
That is why they are leaning into Play Series, Kontakt Libraries, and NKS Hardware/Software Upgrades. It's also why they are committing to Maschine 2. Expansion use is probably driven heavily by Maschine users.
The only reason I use Battery 4, now, is to preview Expansion Content and drag/drop samples to the DAW from its browser, and the user experience is absolutely abysmal for that. But, it's the best thing we have left since they nerfed Komplete Kontrol so hard and it's now impossible to do so from its browser. I might have to uninstall Komplete Kontrol and revert back to an earlier version of it, the new one is so unusable for me…
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Maschine literally has a Drum Sampler built into it.
They will never integrate Maschine with plug-ins directly, becasue they'd rather you buy extra hardware from them (Komplete Kontrol keyboards) so you can host a plug-in within a plug-in to get your keyboard to work with it.
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"But, it's the best thing we have left since they nerfed Komplete Kontrol so hard and it's now impossible to do so from its browser. I might have to uninstall Komplete Kontrol and revert back to an earlier version of it, the new one is so unusable for me…"
I have now taken took KK and Battery right out of the "preview" equation and loaded all my NI Expansion content (AND the Battery library itself) into ADSR Sample Manager - which also runs as a VST3 - bringing the entire NI library into one super easy, super fast (search, audition, tweak, D&D) UI.
This thing allows me to D&D anything, anywhere at anytime - Studio One timeline, Impact XT drum pads, into any Sample One, into Drop Designer (Skybox Audio) , into XLN Audio XO - you name it.
It is incredibly fun to shed about 8 layers of hassle factor and get right into the sounds like this.
VP
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@Vocalpoint
That's fine, but before they nerfed Komplete Kontrol, I could do this without installing additional software on my machine and "Converting" 100K Samples/Loops worth of Expansion Content to use in an additional application… simply to gain back a function that worked perfectly fine before they intentionally mucked it up.
The Native Instrument developers are completely oblivious to how their changes affect users.
All ADSR would do is make workflow worse, since I also use that one browser instance to preview Synth and Instrument Patches before loading them directly in the sampler instances in the browser.
Now, instead of having one thing open, I'll need to have two things open. It's one step forward + one step back.
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Everyone's workflow is different. I use KK for instruments - pure and exclusive.
Samples are another workflow and ADSR works for me. BTW it does not "convert" anything. Reads, tags and makes available.
In your case - if you are seeking a "single" solution - not exactly sure why you would ever bother with KK3 right now.
It offers zero advantages (unless you actually own a MKIII board) over KK 2.9.6 - which is faster, feature complete (as it will get) and has no issue with drag and drop.
VP
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The ADSR Sample Manager is certainly one of the most valuable tools in my arsenal. However, once you're dealing with multisampled instruments (as in velocity mapped samples), it's of little help. Sometimes even more to the opposite as it will display all the samples mapped to one note. Still a must-have for everyone dealing with one-shot samples a lot.
Btw, Loopcloud has once been almost as good, partially even better, but it's turned into advertisement hell.
However, one thing neither of the two can offer, would be Battery's "with parameter" preview. Which is just excellent (and as said, it was even switcheable before they came up with the mess that is Battery 4).
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"The ADSR Sample Manager is certainly one of the most valuable tools in my arsenal. However, once you're dealing with multisampled instruments (as in velocity mapped samples), it's of little help. Sometimes even more to the opposite as it will display all the samples mapped to one note. Still a must-have for everyone dealing with one-shot samples a lot."
True dat. It is certainly not the be-all and end-all when it to comes to every situation but for those of us who view samples/loops as a quick and dirty solution most of the time - ADSR rules.
For my workflow - I liken it to baking a cake. Little of this. Sprinkle of that. In this state of mind - all I care about is Search, Audition and D&D. What that sample "ingredient" becomes once it enters my Studio One "cake" is a whole other story.
That said - I did REALLLLLLLYYYYYYY tried to "like" (and use) the KKv2 native tools for the NI sample and loop content right up until some bug hit the racks a year or two ago where if I opened a Loop via my S61 MKII - it would open (correctly) in the internal "Audio" app but then if I shifted over to a One-Shot - instead of opening (logically) in the internal "Sampler" app - it too would open in the internal "Audio" app.
Doing this about three times in succession (having to reload each sample or loop back and forth in it's correct internal app) was time I was never going to get back - so I switched over the ADSR for all my content and never looked back.
VP
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First of all there is no discussion, this product is as dead as you can get and discussing what Battery needs is just funny and a waste of time. The fact that there is no official feedback from NI about this and the fact that NI has gone out of there way to make all NI presets non exportable or convertible should actually be grounds for some sort of legal action. ****** are people supposed to do now as Battery 4 does not work and actually all NI VST's seem like they are on a swift trajectory to being broken without any message or feedback from the company. This smells of either severe employee sabotage or the most severe C level fuc# up in the history of software. Whats crazy is that Battery 4 and Reaktor are still cutting edge without easy replacements unless you buy Abelton pro or Bitwig for the extreme modular stuff and I still don't know if it matches Reaktor (Honestly battery 4 has faults but its still the best drum sampler I can't use anymore, people here might disagree but in terms of results it was top notch until it could not load presets.) Please NI Just write a paragraph about what is being developed and what is shutdown, don't even allow comments if needed.
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Battery 4 is part of the 360 subscription… that is a good sign for the future of this product.
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Sticking a 2011 product in a 2024 subscription won’t change the fact that it’s dead.
Super easy to include legacy items to increase the overall value proposition.
NI has had over 13 years to do something with this. It is what it is.VP
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made me chuckle. thanks.
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