Does the NI Forum Community Culture need a change?
Comments
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if you want to give out prizes, maybe consider a genuinely random choice out of everyone who received at least n points in a given period. N could be 1 even.
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i think that perhaps this particular thread is not the ideal choice since it was born out of a different, very specific one, but A sticky thread makes sense - we used to have those, didn't we?
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Oh…so I’m not the only one that in the OP noticed
But nor is it good to over police and steer the narrative unfairly. And freedom of expression only works when others can/will say things you don't agree with and even don't like. It is a slippery slope. But I really do think that moderators on any forum have a responsibility to work towards maintaining a healthy middle ground and I am not sure we have that at the moment.
The thread has then been derailed into something else (also interesting, but a different thing), aiming more on how to limit users’ wrong behaviours, but discussing that part too could be useful.
The forum could definitely benefit from more moderators presence. With this I mean more people from NI doing NI job. If the company is so big and has so many customers, they should understand that this also bring responsibilities. If you sell to more people (or more products), you must be ready also to serve this incremented number of customers. You must hire more people to do the support job, you can’t think to leave 4-5 people to manage a forum composed by so many users. Specially if between that little amount of people some are volunteers and not NI employees. These guys CAN’T do the work that should be done by a lot more people. Specially if the state you release your products need an high level of support. This will surely lead also them to being under pressure and nervous, therefore not in the condition to do their job at best.
An incremented number of “professionals” could also help on the other matters being discussed here: if an user coming to the forum to solve a problem will receive support from someone from NI trained to do that and expert in what he is saying, a lot less problems between users will arise. And the need of users helping users will not be so fundamental (therefore also the need of incentives like prizes would not be necessary)
Take as an example the last case brought to attention here (the one of the guy writing in German): no doubt the guy was not acting well, but surely seeing other users answer him and even criticizing his rant didn’t help to quiet down the situation. A professional NI employee trying to find a solution for his case and/or telling him his behavior was not the more appropriate surely would (or should?) have managed things in a more professional way.
Therefore my conclusion is, as said, that if NI wants to be the big company leading the sector it must also behave accordingly, hiring people to show they ARE the big company leading the sector.
This is valid here for the forum like it is for the support done through tickets. If you constantly have to say “we know we are not reacting as fast as we would like” it just means one thing: as a company you are under employing some sectors that simply need more workers. If you have to start on June to say “we have many support requests because we are under Summer of Sound sales” to then continue with “now it’s Black Friday” and then “it’s end of the year sale”… it means your customers must HOPE to have problems only during the first 6 months of the year, because the other 6 the support is too busy to be efficient.
Same thing applies to the development of the products: imo if so many products lately are released “not ready” or in a rush, the fault is by the company that is underemploying the people who has to do the job. A rightly composed (and sufficient) team surely wouldn’t have released after years of work KK and the new keyboard in the state they have been released (same for Maschine+ update: one update in one year should at least have been significant and perfect). Or even wouldn’t need so much time to adapt to Apple’s new OS or VST3 transition. Some say “it’s because NI has a lot more products to take care of”. I will answer again “if you are bigger than the others, you must be bigger even in the number of your employees”. You do 20 times more products than another company? You must also have 20 times more employees!
Once again: doing big sales that increment a lot your sells doesn’t mean only putting the money of those sales in your pockets, but also be ready to serve this increment.
I hope that what I wrote shows that in my opinion the fault is not by the people working, but by the people wanting to be the big company without investing (hiring) accordingly.
You are BIG? PROVE IT!
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The thread has then been derailed into something else (also interesting, but a different thing), aiming more on how to limit users’ wrong behaviours, but discussing that part too could be useful.
Rather than feeling like this thread has been derailed, I feel like it is simply expanding into peripheral areas that I did not even think of. But since it is all geared towards a the common goal of a better overall experience for users, then that is a good thing.
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Yes, I said that this is also an interesting argument. And surely a good thing.
I just hope the “peripheral areas you didn’t even think of” won’t make your point in the OP be forgotten or ignored
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I read the forum a lot but dont post much
The community is quite cool and respectful.
This is not so common in the internet
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Trust me, we are not all adults here. There's teenagers with big ego's. There's are also problem of semantics. It not uncommon for someone to misunderstand what you say; take it the wrong way and run with it. It's never easy and clearly impossible to control. Just let em argue or portray themselves as experts and never learn anything as a result of that type of behavior. Not everyone has people skills and they stick out like a soar thumb. No sweat, every forum is like that.
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I agree, I can think of many that are worse. I think where this differs from most company forums though is it is a lot less managed than is usually the case, which makes a lot of them feel quite sterile environments (with certain exceptions eg the Reaper forum is also very lively). Because of that it feels more like a real music community than any other company forum I’ve come across and I hope that continues.
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I agree with these sentiments too.
The current NI community feels a bit above the norm with a helpful vibe overall. The abusive posts certainly occur, but they tend to mostly be from just a few users.
And I think NI has also done an above average job with having the occasional posts from high-level product decision makers that I find very interesting and helpful for longer term thinking.
And all the talk in this thread about points, rewards and such... I am oblivious to it. I don't even think about it at all.
If I were to comment on it, I'd suggest do away with it all and just have NI hire a few more customer support people and have them rotate spending time with assistance here.
And make it a nice remote job in multiple timezones and different language skills. If done well, it will play for itself.. shift some $$ from advertising.. good customer support IS "advertising".
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If I were to comment on it, I'd suggest do away with it all and just have NI hire a few more customer support people and have them rotate spending time with assistance here.
That'd lose a huge amount of experience though. Regardless of how good the inhouse customer support is there are going to be real users with combinations of hardware and software that have had and fixed problems that NI support have never heard of or anticipated. That's nothing against NI staff btw, it's just common sense.
-- Mike
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If we don't get derailed, we live in a bubble. People like to brainstorm and those who have no idea what the topic is end up derailing the thread. It's as crazy as it can get. lol
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Users could still certainly offer solutions too. It could be both some paid staff keeping the solutions flowing and users that felt like sharing their advice.
If a customer support person had a real stumper, they would also be good liaisons to better articulate the problem a user might be having and reach out the community for an assist.
I dont think the community would lose any collective brainpower... in that I can hardly believe that it is rewards and incentives that keep most current "helpers" doing what they do.
If I'm wrong on this.. and those that are currently helping others actually ARE doing it for rewards and incentives... jeez. I honestly thought most people did it just because they enjoyed helping.
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It has been 2 days now that i see this thread and i have read every single comment.
I have many things to say, partly because they concerns me, partly because i care for this community. Some of them are really important to be heard, some are simply a different and perhaps more insightful view of things, and some are just experience and possible solutions to offer but really, i am afraid to write anything because someone might find it "offensive" or perhaps "incomprehensible" or whatever.
I have been attacked 2-3 times without having any idea why, while i was defending someone else, a member or even Native Instruments against some really rude newcomers. And instead of having support from other members for doing the right thing, i was attacked. So, yes, i am afraid to write anything out of suggestions to users who seeks answers, because i value my inner peace.
In advance, i can tell you that i have no intention to offend anyone, so whatever you may read, please do not take it personally. It is just my experience from life and the different way that i use words, because English is not my mother language.
For almost 20 years (since the times of Yahoo Groups) i have constantly been a creator, an administrator or a moderator on numerous Forums, Websites or Facebook Groups (right now, i administer 3 Facebook groups with approximately 7000 members, all together). All those years, there hasn't be a single day that i am not in a similar position somewhere, even though i am not always active. I am also a blogger with my own personal blog, since 2007 (so, yes i like to write!).
I tell you this. This forum is maybe the most peaceful place i ever see on the net! This is not a joke, it is the reality. So, i have the impression that, many of you might be new to forums and their circumstances.
You may say that Forums is a "micrography" of the real life. Thus you can find as many types of persons as in real life too. And this is healthy, as we all learn about how different cultures have different rules or priorities and different reactions and different views and this is what Humanity is. A multicultural mosaic, not a homogenized soup.
So, i will proceed with my points of view, suggestions and conclusions in another comment. People on the internet don't like to read long texts, and i want you all to read what i have to say.
For now, i wish to all of you Merry Christmas and peace in your hearts.🙏
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There are a number of posts on this thread suggesting that there are plenty of forums out there that are far worse behaved and so there is no need to improve the "vibe" on this forum. Fair enough.
But I ask, why do they have to be the measuring stick by which we judge ourselves? Why does the bar have to be so low?
I think we would be doing a good job as a group if we became the measuring stick by which other forums measure themselves.
Further, several posts oppositely suggested that this forum lacks the amount of moderation that is present on other forums and that this a factor in the overall level of unruliness. Fair enough also.
And those two unsurprising ends of the feedback spectrum dovetail with the original intent of the post which was simply striving for an optimal middle ground. Nothing more. Nothing Less.
Dynamic moderation. Stepped up when things get out of hand and cut back when all is well. Well defined boundaries so everyone knows what is crossing the line and consistent responses when it happens.
And a combination of additional moderators and better tools for self-moderation will help make it happen.
And IF we can manage that, we still won't please everybody. But if we can please the most possible, then why not?
Merry Christmas!
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There are a number of posts on this thread suggesting that there are plenty of forums out there that are far worse behaved and so there is no need to improve the "vibe" on this forum. Fair enough.
If you took from those posts that just because some here have seen far worse, that they were saying, or implying, there is 'no need to improve the "vibe" on this forum' then you have not understand those posts. The 2 things are not mutually exclusive, it is perfectly possible to think, relatively speaking, this forum is better behaved than many, and still think there is room for improvement in communication and constructive interaction. Not everyone thinks in such black and white terms, it's really all shades of grey.
Merry Xmas/Happy Hanukkah
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