Does the NI Forum Community Culture need a change?
Comments
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Isn't it about both sides already?
We talked about the reward program potentially being having a negative effect. We talked about the moderation being too absent in certain cases and too strict in others.
I'm not sure if you meant dissatisfaction in a more general terms but if the root cause is really "support is slow" or "updates are buggy" then obviously the scope of this conversation isn't the right one.
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I was confused about the part I said I was confused about, not the tickets. I understand why someone would get mad over tickets being ignored but i fail to see how a thread about improving the forum is a scheme to "suppress anger"
And speaking of anger that's what I am feeling right now reading that post... let me tell you something buddy:
You're not entitled to my help, I help if and when I want...
I certainly will not provide any support in a youtube comment section on a complicated topic, I don't remember you reaching out 3x, I've helped thousands... the first time I remember seeing you asking for help was recently and I immediately went out of my way to help you. Told you I would download a demo from a DAW I don't even use to check your project, you didn't send anything, then I proceeded to do what you needed help with, recorded it, edited, and uploaded just to help you.... And you're complaining? Seriously? I'm not your mommy or paid tech support.
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Wow. Yeah, ok. Speaking of professionalism. Perhaps you shouldnt comment as if you do support then, and you shouldnt portray the situation dishonestly, as if I failed to ask for help when I was ASKING FOR HELP FOR MONTHS. Im sure that embarrasses you, but that isnt my problem.
Yikes.
Edit: perhaps remove the "YouTube" link in your sig, then, if you dont want to have to "mommy" people when they ask for help. My goodness! lmao
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Let's not derail this thread on individual cases and support issues that have nothing to do with the topic here. It can be dealt with separately and I will moderate the thread if it keeps going.
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I've seen that a lot. People post generic answers they found on the Internet after doing a quick search that can be completely out of date, or just roll out their standard "this worked for me" response to every issue. There's a place for that of course for standard problems like "I upgraded my Kontakt libraries and now they don't work". One thing I don't know how you'd police is incorrect or just plain bad advice, for example "You have to upgrade to Kontakt 7" when a user has the above problem.
-- Mike
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Moderate away, and this is related to what Im talking about. I just tried to flag my first comment ever as "abusive", but wasnt allowed to because the person is protected, lol, despite having made very rude, inappropriate comments to me about doing actual support. You may want to reign in some of your mods, but hey dont take my word for it. This is just an "individual support case" (related to other support cases) that is undesirable in this thread. I get it! We have to change the culture here, yes.
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D-One may be a N.I. approved forum Moderator but as far as I understand then he is still only a volunteer forum moderator and not a paid help. Hence the "he helps if and when he wants". And D-One being a volunteer Moderator then while he is a forum Moderator then I think that he is still not a member of the team that handles your not solved support issues so he has most likely not had any knowledge of those !
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I understand all of this 100%, which is why I was confused when he replied to my other comments, which werent to do with him at all. When I mentioned "delay in support", I think he took that personally without considering I was talking about tickets, comments, and posts. Being someone who has done unpaid support for most of his life, I dont make a habit of offering my services, then clutching my pearls when people try to take me up on them, but yeah I get it.
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@Matt_NI wrote:
To recap : Abuse/Spam flag gets points down but don’t get a mod notified. Report flag don’t change points but creates a hidden discussion to notify a mod/admin.
Then i shall only use 'report' from now on, since when i previously used 'abuse/spam' it was only to notify an admin, not 'punish' a user with a deduction of points (which i couldn't care less about doing).
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+1.
Language; some parts are harder to interpret than others. Sarcasm is easy to misunderstand, so i avoid it.
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Is there some NI-branded chill pill for distribution. After hearing a range of views from the relay of past/anecdotal experiences & philosophical thoughts about group dynamics, it came to mind that one's world view should not be imposed to another. We are all different. The only question to ask ourselves is if you agree that the world is big enough for more than one world view.
On the chill pill, suggest to add a "pending moderator approval" function so that recalcitrant offenders would have any post vetted before being published. More work at admin/mod end but the effort helps everyone (sans the self-entitled-insert-your-label person).
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Or maybe we will all just behave? Problem sorted :)
I was VERY critical of NI during M1 transition, but I have never insulted anyone. It’s certainly doable.
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Thanks for all the feedback. I'm on board with adding Reddit-style downvote and upvote reactions. This could help bring visibility to the most valuable contributions/popular opinions as well.
I've noticed a bunch of discussions about the rewards system, and I'm thinking about how we can make it better. Just a reminder, we introduced it because people wanted it.
@wayfinder says
any rewards system is gameable at some level, and some people will always try to game it; if you want to have rewards, that's a fact you have to live with. it also means that ANY performance indicator you come up with will over time become less reliable as people optimize for the number instead of the underlying quality it is abstracting
that said, and i realize that this might come across as self-serving, perhaps the number of points divided by the number of posts from a user is a more useful measure than points alone?
If post quality is the thing, maybe we can look at the number of accepted answers instead of just points.
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I mostly hang around the traktor forum and don't have many issues with other users. There are a few but not that much.
What really gets me going is that I have seen several instances of dev / mods softbanning a thread. And in both cases I'm aware of it was just people reporting forum bugs or other issues. Now new posts into those threads will not push them to the front any more. If you don't keep attention the poster will spend time reporting bugs and not notice his thread is "dead"
All with NI not saying a word. It's frustrating once you notice it.
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@Kaiwan_NI "If post quality is the thing, maybe we can look at the number of accepted answers instead of just points."
The thing is: More than often - at least in my experience - users either rarely mark posts as something or mis-mark posts as "correct answer" by (what I assume) sheer accident
- likehere for example(Edit: Matt fixed it - thank you). I often see Jeremy marking posts of mine as "correct answer" days later because OPs often forget to do it or (what I assume) don't know that they can do it. But... this shouldn't be his or any staff's responsibility as it's additional work.A reward system only makes sense when everything connected to it works reliably. It just doesn't (yet).
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