Maschine Plus - Drop outs when changing scenes (MAS-29716)

Andy Wt

Actually M+ can do it, check my comment above. These sample Attack/Decay default non-zero values are also very confusing when slicing drumloops. Its required to edit each sliced sample individually afterwards to reset attack/decay to 0. Otherwise sliced loop sounds absolutely not like original.

S Righteous

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/48428#Comment_48428

You have helped me out of the rabbit warren. This totally fixes the issue with the click when resampling.

So I've tried this again, and adjusted the attack and decay (weird that these default to anything but zero). Also noticed that if you truncate your sample, it re-adds the defaults. Weird.

This sounds much better, and I can get the sample to match the sound of the dry kick synth!

However adding the plate reverb with the same settings gets weird again. The sample sounds louder, and is louder in the mixer, the reverb is adding more volume to the sample than the kick synth. The kick synth really melts into the verb in a nicer sounding way volume difference aside.

Thanks for showing me those default settings that I will always want to unset!

S Righteous

Thanks again Andy Wt

A few milliseconds of attack is something you can notice missing from an 808 kick. I now wonder if I have other samples with this issue. But I rarely resample, and if I didn't notice, it doesn't matter. . .

For whatever reasons, the same reverb settings do not sound the same with the sample as they do with the Kick Synth. But I can get the sound very similar by adjusting them. Strangely using half the mix percent on the sample makes it sound more like the Kick Synth - weird. But now I'm close enough. Rabbit journey complete.

S Righteous

So testing everything after replacing the Kick synth with a sample, and I can transition to those Scenes without any issue.

But guess what - I am only using one synth in my entire project and it's flubbing up. I'm using Massive for a mono bass line, and when I switch from a scene that doesn't use Massive, to one which does, the audio drops for a moment, and it totally flubs the rhythm.

Just as before, once I make that scene transition (and I guess, Massive loads?) then it's fine and the issue won't happen until the next time I load up the project.

WoW, just WoW - NI.

So perhaps I need a muted scene which has my synth in it, which I play as an intro to every song. . .

How do people use more than one synth in Maschine+ and not have this issue?

ozon

This is quite interesting (though aggravating).

Although I’m always using at least 3-4 Synths (mostly Monark, Bass Synth, Poly Synth, rarely Massive) and often several Drum Synths, I haven’t observed this issue. Most probably because I’m not using the M+ for live performance but rather to sketch down ideas and play around with arrangements.

Can you reproduce this issue with just one Group with only this Kick loadad? If so, we could try this minimal Project and see if the problem can be reproduced on different M+. If not it might come down to a hardware failure. If yes, it‘s a software issue that can be forwarded to the development team and potentially get fixed.

S Righteous

I will see about making a project which shows this issue.

I have a weird feeling that there is some kind of 'dynamic' loading, and so perhaps only large projects will exhibit this behaviour, as in samples load first, synths load as needed.

Andy Wt

@ozon As i can see this issue is more related to overall CPU utilization level than to some specific plugin. In my case its starts emerging when project reaches state where it consumes about 35-40% CPU idle and group count reaches above maybe 10. But at the same time many demo projects with 60% CPU at idle and with number of groups less than 8 played perfectly fine. Aforementioned Bumbledoople is 40-41%. And if memory serves me well, this issue was less pronounced on earlier versions of SW - the number of projects affected was less and where it happened it was less audible. I'm talking about 1.4.0 vs 1.4.4 and 1.4.5.

ozon

@Andy Wt unfortunately I don’t have that Expansion, otherwise I’d check it out. If you know of other Projects which exhibit that behavior, I’ll happily try to reproduce the problem.

If it is actually depending on FW/SW/OS version, then it’s definitely a software issue.

S Righteous

Here is my simple test project.

It only has 3 samples, idles at 10% CPU, Scene 1 (just kick and hats) runs at 15% CPU, Scene 2 where I add the Massive synth jumps to 20-30% CPU and hiccups.

3 banks: 1 = kick sample + effects, 2 = two hat samlpes + effects, 3 = Massive + effects.

When you load the project, select scene 1, hit play and select scene 2. It will hiccup going into the synth part the first time, but not after that. This is not as noticeable as when I was using the Kick synth as well. But it barfs consistently for me.

Note, reloading the project does not reset the bug. You have to restart Maschine+

test_project_v4.zip

ozon

Indeed. There's a crackle on when the first note is played by Massive.

It does not happen:

• On repeated plays or Scene switches
• If a new Project is created and then the test Project is reloaded
• If another Project is loaded and then the test Project is reloaded
• If the Massive sound is played by hitting the Pad before starting the Project
• If a new Project is created, any other Massive sound is loaded, and played and then the test Project is reloaded

So it seems to happen only once after booting the M+ if any Massive sound is played for the first time ever. I wasn't able to reproduce it any other way.

ozon

@S Righteous I submitted a bug report referencing this thread. If it is ok for you, I could also upload your test project.

DeepThumb

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/48632#Comment_48632

Hi, My Elektron boxes need some time after loading a project before they are up and running.

Can the M+ issue be solved by waiting for some seconds after loading?

S Righteous

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/48636#Comment_48636

Yes please use this project with the bug report for sure - and thanks!

S Righteous

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/48632#Comment_48632

Just to note: In this example, it's Massive which causes the issue, but I also had it happening when using the Kick Synth, and in different cases the results were much worse than what you hear with this example. This is not an isolated thing for me, but happens on other projects, and not just with Massive.

It's hard to hear what is going on with that Massive synth, so I made it a very obvious 16th note pattern, and the flub is on the first beat of the bar. However I have tested using a pattern with just three notes, on every third beat of the bar, and the first of those gets flubbed.

I had been thinking the issue was related to dynamic loading of plugins at the start of a scene where they are suddenly needed. I no longer think so. Because it's not just notes on the first beat of the first bar which have the issue (I have had other gear with that exact problem). When the first note is on the third beat, there is lots of time for loading/prepping, whatever, and it still flubs.

With this example, it does seem mostly like a sound quality issue - a 'crackle' as you say, but usually when I have the problem, the crackle is less jarring than the timing.

It seems as if either:

1) The first note is played late, but the second note is on time, so the rhythm is off.

2) The first note is actually cut off, as in there is an audio drop-out during it, placing a pause in the rhythm.

The issue is less noticeable in this example, because I wanted to clearly show the lowest CPU usage, by only using 3 samples and one synth. This example uses notes of a short length, so perhaps with longer notes (strings?) the issue would feel more like one of timing.

ozon

@S Righteous ok, I added the project and your comments above to the bug report. Thank you.

Also, I've defintely heard this crackle/lag on a "first" note happen on some Expansion Projects and also on my own, but thought it was due to high CPU load.