Q&A with Maschine/Maschine Plus team?
Comments
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Not wrong and fair points on which reasoning before buying a 1000 bucks device.
My experience:
I doubt a mk2 is on the way. Force is largely underestimated (even if people are starting noticing it) and I don’t know how much it did sell. Which makes me appreciate Akai’s job in constantly improving it anyway even more. Either one or the other: they really have faith in the project or they have a strong ethic towards their users. In both cases, my applause.
Another plus is that it is often developed in tandem with MPC on many aspects, therefore the success of one or the other is carrying the development of both devices.
Yes, it is from 2019, but these 4 years just made it better and better. What it can do nowadays is A LOT more than what it was able of at its launch. Again: constant development, refinement and features adding is promising. Even only the addition of the sequencer and song mode was huuuuuge.
To mimic Live isn’t a bad thing imo. Live is a damn’ good product and in the last year or 2 many other companies copied what it can do, specially clip launching structure to test ideas (GarageBand and then Logic Pro, now even Pro Tools,…). Force made an ulterior step and introduced also the clip launching recording to arranger…on a standalone device.
And I politely don’t agree that it’s just trying to be good. It IS good ☺️
Gain knobs (which are waaaaaaaay more than just gain…unless you are talking about the ones on the back and not the ones on the device)…everyone has different “sensibility”, but I don’t find them clunky at all (again: unless you are talking about the ones on the back)
About pads…nothing to say. Maschine’s ones are way better. I would even say they are from different galaxies (being it even only for the dimensions, but here will come the debate 16 pads vs 64…different uses case. What 16 pads can give is different from what 64 can: sensitivity vs range, finger drumming vs chords playing, and so on and so forth…). That said, Force ones aren’t bad at all.
Of course the choice depends on what one is after: one of the main criticism moved against Maschine is about automations and macros. Well…on those aspects, Force is a MONSTER
And probably my main point: Force offers things no other device offers (standalone or controller).
One over all: the ability to use it simultaneously controlling 4 different aspects of the production/playing. You can, e.g., divide the pads in 2 sections, one for playing instruments/drum racks, the other for clip launching/recording (or step sequencing)…and in the meanwhile having the knobs controlling different things (macros, fxs, volumes,…)….and in the meanwhile having the touchscreen controlling ulterior other things… I challenge any other Groovebox/controller to do that much all at your fingertips without having to menu diving or “switching” functionalities. Usually to do something similar I need 3-4 controllers.
And the flexibility it has… You want fxs on the knobs? No problem. You want them on the touchscreen (maybe with XY pads)? No problem. You want them on the pads? No problem.And again: what do you want the knobs to do? Controlling what is on the screen? A different thing (volumes, pans, fxs, macros,…)? Being only a switch on/off for fxs by just touching them without even turning them? No problem. You want to clip launch on the touchscreen and play on the pads? No problem. You want to clip launch on the pads and see the plugin interface (usable, not only an image) on the screen (while the knobs take care of ulterior tasks)? No problem! When a device answers me with that many “no problems”, it can only become my friend ☺️
That said…yes…Force is, at the eye and design-wise (visually, not as practicalness), …well…simply AWFUL 😂. Even only the inclined small screens of the knobs…who designed that??? But then…when you don’t have to lean forward in order to read them properly…OH! So useful!
Its aspect… in the end…who cares? When my brain is focused on all the things it allows me to do, even its physical aspect falls unnoticed. Remember: you have to be beautiful INSIDE, not OUTSIDE 😂.
And yes…I do love Maschine and its workflow more (even because I learnt it so much more and I grew with it). My problem is I’m not so sure NI does too…
Hope this can be useful, even not to take a decision, but at least to understand Force better 😉
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You explained everything better than me and more complete :)
As I said, I was afraid of having to start learning the Workflow Force again while I loved that of M+ so much, especially after having already installed the MPC ONE (after the 707), but ultimately the Force is much more logical for me and easy as the MPC, and I record loops from my Minilogue XD and TD3 in 30 seconds, it's as simple as on M+, and reworking these loops is even easier. Afterwards I take the Force with a battery and headphones, and I continue to work at my place of work or vacation. I love doing it like this.
I go much further with the Force than what I did on M+, the Force has 2 faults for me, the non-tilting screen, and the weight, but I find it to be of excellent manufacturing quality (and I like was able to compare) my ranking would be 707, MPC, Force and just a little above M+.
My only wish would be to be able to connect a mouse to it, to draw automation curves more easily (something impossible on M+ in standalone mode) and sometimes to modify samples/loops, but I think I have really adapted to it. 'touch screen .
to summarize, I would say that Force is the most powerful and complete standalone groovebox, lots of memory, internal SSD, workflow requiring a little more learning time, but in the end which allows more things, by being more at the comfortable (in terms of power and possibility), but heavy (and who thought that not putting an adjustable screen for €50 more would be a good idea?)😅
Akai's follow-up for the Force compared to that of Ni for the M+ was also decisive in my choice, the M+ dates from 2020, but what future? what room for improvement does she have?
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To anyone his taste.
I agree on many of your points, specially not liking MPC workflow (I keep my Live 2 just because of the integrated battery and the speaker), but on this I’m almost sure is a matter of habits (although I was using the old MPCs back in the days, as soon as I discovered Maschine workflow I knew it was perfect for me…and now, after almost 15 years of Maschine, going back to the MPC “structure” is hard).
But for example I wouldn’t like a reclining screen (ala MPC X) on the Force, although I’m sure that if I would use it, the effect would be the same as the one of the knobs screens (“who thought it” but then “ooooh…so useful”) ☺️
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I've been contemplating going back to a Force unfortunately as well. It way more complicated to set up stuff, and I don't like the sample editing and warping/timestretch. Those are much simpler on M+. However, I absolutely hate M+'s file structure/reliance on tags, and miss not being able to edit automation. Also hated the Force's size/weight and non-tilting screen.
There are hacks out there that adds a tilt-able screen however.
The other interesting development is that someone has a hack that loads Force firmware on a Live II. So that coupled with a Launchpad could give a nice alternative I suppose. Tilt the Live II on a stand and use the LP to control clips. Part of me wants to wait though and see if there is a Force 2.
I feel like any needed Maschine changes will come with a new model instead of improving what is here... hope I'm wrong.
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@expermusic said:
There are hacks out there that adds a tilt-able screen however.
Oh, I never saw that before, just watched it on youtube and looks cool. If I ever switch to a Force that would be the 1st thing I'd do.
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Mods by Dream Static ?
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Yes. I was watching the video and also looking deeply at my Resin 3D printer, I'd def make a design if I had access to an AKAI Force, looks like a fun project.
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Besides everything - Akai should add arranger to MPCs. I have One+ yeah it's not perfect but at this price point - maaaaan. Nobody is giving you so much. I love some effects, even paid ones. Flavour Pro is amazing, Jura sounds awsome. I finally i love mpcs swing - this makes my drums tight AF. I love tight drums!
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"Manufacturing quality ranked" (presumably from best to worst?) "707, MPC, Force and just a little above M+"?
Owning all of these apart from the Force, which looks to have the same type of metal cage design of the One, I would disagree. I would put them in reverse order with M+ being at the top. I don't think anybody before has ever said the MC-707 is a well manufactured piece of gear. It's better built than a lot of modern Roland plastic gear, but it still feels cheap with low quality faders and poor feeling buttons, knobs and encoder and maybe using mid quality plastic. Certainly not in the same league as a Push 2 or even a MK3. The only upside of that is that it's pretty light.
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I ranked from least good to best.
(Manufacturing quality)
707, One, Force and M+ at the top.
You do not agree ?
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Yes, arranger mode like on the Force.
I saw that you could install the Force firmware on MPC X. AKAI could almost leave the choice to its users.
MPC or Force workflow
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Yep, that's the order I would put them from worst to best, which is what I said above.
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Totally agree. 👌♥️🙏
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Though not especially thorough for all features of the instrument, the 'Trutorial' YouTube series from NI for Maschine is some of the best demos of groovebox features around and truly show the variety of things you can do with Maschine. There's probably 40+ of them and I highly recommend them and guarantee there are techniques you don't know about in there. It's also all in the context of music - no influencer on camera, no VO, just music and the audible result of the technique demonstrated.
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End of october and still no statment about Maschine roadmap, no update, no nothing.
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