Please confirm Maschine can't route MIDI from a VST/AU plugin?

gfm
gfm Member Posts: 3 Newcomer
edited May 2022 in Maschine

I'm trying to route MIDI output from a VST plugin (Hypercyclic, Tonespace or Reaktor) to another instrument in Maschine and I can't figure this out. Tutorials I've found online suggest using either a physical MIDI loopback cable (??) or the IAC Driver on Mac, but both of these solutions really get in the way.

Is there really no way to just directly route the MIDI output of a plugin to another instrument? Am I just doing this wrong?

The IAC Driver workaround can be made to work because you then have to set the default MIDI input mode to None, otherwise whatever is feeding the virtual loopback will play on whatever is in focus in Maschine.

Doesn't work

This seems like it should work, but doesn't do what you would expect (instead it just routes MIDI notes recorded to the pattern to the other destination). This works in another DAW I tried it in (Reason) so I'm pretty sure its not a problem with the plugin:


This works, but requires a ton of extra configuration and constantly gets in your way

Every time you add a new instrument you now need to set up what channel it should monitor for recording... ugh


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Comments

  • Sequencesounds
    Sequencesounds Member Posts: 51 Helper
    edited May 2022

    Its a real pain, but I find using Bidule, Bluecat (or another vst host plugin - haven't tried and others_ to be the answer

    see these 2 threads for more details

    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/11058#Comment_11058

  • gfm
    gfm Member Posts: 3 Newcomer

    @Sequencesounds thank you for the reply, this gives me some ideas on how else to potentially work around this. I don't think using a VST-hosting VST-plugin would be a good solution though because then I would lose the ability to use Maschine to control NI instruments, like Massive...

    In summary, the answer is 'no', Maschine does not support any kind of MIDI routing between plugins. Darn.

  • Schmapps1
    Schmapps1 Member Posts: 107 Advisor

    Yeah it’s a real pain. The ability to route MIDI internally in Maschine is another one of those features that has been requested forever…but the request seems to just float away into the ether.. 🤷‍♂️

  • gfm
    gfm Member Posts: 3 Newcomer
    edited May 2022


    I'm a bit baffled this isn't supported. I've grown to really like Maschine as a DAW but there are a few places (like this one) where I'm scratching my head why its not better.. with just a little more work Maschine could be a great standalone DAW.

    NI, if you're reading this, please consider adding another option under the Sound -> Output -> MIDI panel to route plugin output to the selected destination. It could be a three-way selector knob, "Pattern" "Instrument" or "Both". At the moment Maschine will only route MIDI notes from the pattern (or clip, presumably), but it would be VERY USEFUL if you could route the instrument's MIDI output to the destination as well.


  • Sequencesounds
    Sequencesounds Member Posts: 51 Helper
    edited May 2022

    @gfm all controls are mappable to MK3 via Bluecat's Learn Mode - just put that on, then click learn in Maschine to map controls to sounds or macros

    Of course better if it was possible natively, but this method works 100%


  • jmp909
    jmp909 Member Posts: 6 Newcomer
    edited July 2022

    I detailed a solution here https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/23649/#Comment_23649

    you don't need to host your instrument in a separate plugin, just your Midi FX plugin (Hypercylic etc) and a MidiOut plugin from PizJuice connected to a Virtual Midi Cable (LoopMidi in my case), both inside Image-Line's Minihost Modular

  • Yasaf
    Yasaf Member Posts: 10 Newcomer
    edited September 2022

    Am I understanding this correctly?

    Maschine can route midi to itself using a hardline cable but not virtually.

  • D-One
    D-One Moderator Posts: 1,800 mod
    edited September 2022

    Err... Not exactly, it depends on what you want to do.

    You can route MIDI from one Pad to another, however, you cannot route the MIDI Output of a Plugin to another Pad... Meaning if you have a plugin that changes incoming MIDI or generates it's own MIDI then that can't be routed anywhere else. I guess you can look at it as MAS only lets you route MIDI which is actually in its piano roll.

    A physical MIDI cable can provide a workaround of sorts but people tend to only use that in the M+ since for the computer version a plugin wrapper is more practical and flexible.

  • Flexi
    Flexi Member Posts: 366 Pro

    On desktop you can use a virtual cable too.

  • cal
    cal Member Posts: 5 Newcomer
    edited September 2022

    Its astounding to me that this still isn't implemented, its mind boggling, its got to be literally going on around a decade? That along with automation tools and time stretch in sampler.

    In terms of NI implementation of user requests ? Evolution works faster than they do. Glaciers melt faster. Tectonic plates move like Usain Bolt in comparison lol


    BTW whatever happened to the user request list on the old site? That just off gathering dust somewhere?

  • tribepop
    tribepop Member Posts: 144 Advisor

    Yeah this is a massive limitation for Maschine in my opinion. To be fair though I imagine it’s probably not an easy thing to implement due to some underlying way that Maschine works that we are not privy to. It doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t try to implement but I imagine it’s a lot trickier than may seem at first.

    I also imagine they somewhat justify/cope with not being able to use midi generator plugins as the Maschine controller is pretty damn good at producing midi data (e.g. arp, chords, generative midi, etc.) so that may also play into why it’s not been a priority. Generating midi via VST is not as big of an issue for me personally, but not being to automate midi learned controls from external hardware that’s not Maschine is a bummer.

  • Flexi
    Flexi Member Posts: 366 Pro

    I suspect the code is buried so deep to change this, that this months developers would have no idea where to start, Maschine has to have the largest turnaround of developers and support of any music tech in history, support has remained more consistent since Sounwide took over, but at some points in recent times a new lead developer would appear near enough on a monthly basis.

    Basic needed features like this and PDC and etc etc etc, have long since demoted the tech to "Interesting niche thing" just use it for what it is, and if you can see that something was requested ten years ago, assume it is never going to happen, unless you can find some way to word the request as "Will sell more expansions" expansions are the only thing keeping Maschine alive.

  • Moonbot7000
    Moonbot7000 Member Posts: 54 Member

    When I want to route I use Reaper as the host and open Maschine as a VST and I can rout whatever to wherever, kind of a pita to be honest, at it's core, its a midi controller that controls software, you'd think it would have better routing and modulation possibilties (Why can't I route an LFO to the mod lane??!!)

  • Yasaf
    Yasaf Member Posts: 10 Newcomer

    Thanks for all the replies! I've got Patchworks 2.6 running and it works a treat. Awesome, cheers

  • manolo.floyd
    manolo.floyd Member Posts: 12 Newcomer

    Haven't they fixed it yet?

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