Kontrol S Mk3 - MIDI in non-functional (KBDSW-8070)

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KierD
KierD Member Posts: 22 Member
edited July 2 in Komplete General

I have a synth connected to both the MIDI in and MIDI out ports of my KSM3, and I have [MIDI Out Dual] set in the settings.

I can play the KSM3 and the other synth responds, but if I go the other way and play the other synth, nothing happens. Plugins in Komplete Kontrol do not respond, and MIDI monitor shows nothing incoming from the EXT port of the Kontrol S.

The same is true with any synth connected to the KSM3 MIDI in port.

If I connect any of those other synths to any other MIDI interface it works as expected.

Have I missed a configuration step, or does my KSM3 have a problem?

Best Answer

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,939 admin
    Answer ✓

    @nico5 @KierD Thnaks to your information I was able to reproduce the bug, filed it under the reference KBDSW-8070 and forwarded to our devs.

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Answers

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,939 admin

    Are you on Mac or PC?

    If you open the Komplete Kontrol standalone application and you check the MIDI preferences, is the external MIDI port selected?

    Screenshot 2025-07-01 at 16.31.31.png

    This is on Mac, the ports have different names for Windows.

    Also check this section of the manual: https://www.native-instruments.com/ni-tech-manuals/kontrol-s-mk3-manual/en/setting-up-your-keyboard#connecting-external-midi-devices-to-the-keyboard

  • KierD
    KierD Member Posts: 22 Member

    I'm afraid this issue goes deeper than Komplete Kontrol configuration - the Kontrol S is failing to forward MIDI at all, even before we get to application-specific settings.

    Here is Audio MIDI Setup showing the connected devices, and MIDI Monitor showing incoming MIDI.

    The capture you see is me playing a few notes on the KSM3, followed by a few notes on the EX5 connected to the MIDI in port on the KSM3… which isn't entirely helpful, because nothing is logged when no MIDI is forwarded by the KSM3 - hence no logs for KONTROL S61 MK3 Ext.

    If I connect the same EX5 to my Montage M and watch the monitor, I'll see channel 1 MIDI being logged from MONTAGE M Port3 as I play the EX5 - and the same is true with any other MIDI interface.

    image.png
  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,939 admin
    edited July 1

    I can't reproduce this behaviour.

    Do Komplete Kontrol and the Hardware Connections Service have full disk access? How to Enable Full Disk Access on macOS

    If you're on Sequoia, extra steps: How to grant audio apps access to your local network on macOS 15 Sequoia

    If you go on the hardware settings on the keyboard itself, create a new template, that should reset the MIDI template to default (in case of).

    Is your keyboard set to MIDI 1.0 or MIDI 2.0? You could try these steps: How to Switch a Kontrol S-Series MK3 Keyboard to MIDI 1.0

    In the Komplete Kontrol standaloned application we don't recommend ticking the Kontrol S MK3 DAW port, only the Main (USB) and EXT.

  • KierD
    KierD Member Posts: 22 Member

    I'm using a fresh template and the keyboard is set to MIDI 1.0.

    Full disk access and other application-level configuration is not going to help here - I've got a hardware MIDI monitor too, which is unaffected by any software configuration, and it shows the same results as the software MIDI Monitor, ie: no MIDI being forwarded by the MIDI in port on the KSM3.

    So this is starting to sound like an issue with my specific KSM3 hardware, if a new template should enable MIDI transmission. For what it's worth, I can't see any settings in the global config or template config that would enable or disable MIDI receipt and retransmission, so I have to assume the expected behaviour is that MIDI would be received via MIDI in and forwarded over USB, as expected - which mine does not.

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,939 admin
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/232713#Comment_232713

    I would still try to delete the device in your Audio MIDI setup (when the keyboard is disconnected of course) and even if your keyboard is already set to MIDI 1.0. This has fixed some issues on the past with MIDI ports not being recognized. Worth a shot.

    1. After you have set the Kontrol MK3 to MIDI 1.0 (see above), switch the keyboard off.
    2. Start Finder and open Applications > Utilities > Audio MIDI Setup.
    3. In the top menu bar, select Window > Show MIDI Studio.
      5_ShowMidiDevices.png
    4. Select the Kontrol S MK3 and click the "-" button (or press the del key on your computer keyboard).
      6_DeleteMK3entry2.png

    Now if this doesn't work next step would be to test with another computer. If it's the same on that other computer, then it's definitely a hardware fault and you should get in tuch with our support here: https://bit.ly/NI_Support_All

  • KierD
    KierD Member Posts: 22 Member

    Did the Audio MIDI Setup delete and reconnect thing - no change.

    Connected to another computer and ran MIDI Monitor - logs for the KSM3 itself playing, no logs for anything coming in over the KSM3 MIDI in port.

    I guess I'll wait for support to reply to my ticket, because this doesn't seem like something I can fix.

  • nico5
    nico5 Member Posts: 108 Advisor

    @KierD and @Jeremy_NI

    Sorry for interjecting. I'm not sure, if my experience using the S61 MK3 is relevant to the problem in this thread. Since I'm currently using Win10 on my studio computer, some of the MIDI driver and software stack is obviously different between MacOS and Win10.

    However some of the software stack is definitely the same, like

    • the software in the MK3
    • and potentially some common code in the NI drivers for the MK3 on the respective operating systems.

    I've also experienced the MIDI IN becoming unresponsive. And after a couple of hours of troubleshooting, this seems to be what emerged on my system:

    • The device on the sending side of the 5 pin input MIDI cable is continuously streaming MIDI Realtime data, like for example MIDI active sensing messages and/or or MIDI timing messages.
      • When I power up the S61 MK3 while that MIDI IN cable is plugged in, the port stops working.
      • However: When I power up the S61 MK3 while that MIDI IN cable is not plugged in, and only plug in the cable after the S61 Mk3 has finished booting, then the MIDI IN port seems to work as expected. Unplugging and re-plugging the cable seems fine, too.

    Since quite a lot of classic MIDI gear transmits MIDI Active Sensing messages (and sometimes can't be disabled at the source), and typically I keep my cables plugged in between studio sessions / powering down my gear, this ends up looking like the S61 MK3 MIDI IN port is broken.

    Also: I don't know if it's only related to MIDI realtime messages or if it could be any MIDI message that shows up at the wrong time during the MK3 bootup process.

    @KierD I don't know if you already tried booting your MK3 with the MIDI cable unplugged and then only plugging it in afterwards. If not, it might be worth trying?

    @Jeremy_NI Should I file a separate bug report, or will you forward this to the support or development team?

  • KierD
    KierD Member Posts: 22 Member

    Thanks @nico5 , I’ll give that a try this afternoon and post back with results. I would certainly file a bug report if you can reliably reproduce this behaviour.

  • KierD
    KierD Member Posts: 22 Member

    @Jeremy_NI i can confirm @nico5 ’s report.

    Booting the KSM3 with the external synth disconnected from DIN MIDI in results in proper operation when the external synth is connected after KSM3 has finished booting.

    Booting with the external synth connected results in no forwarding from MIDI in.

    So this sounds much more like a firmware issue than a hardware fault unique to my unit.

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,939 admin

    @KierD Ok, thanks for confirming. I have tried to reproduce the issue on my end without success, so it might depend on the type of devices connected and setup differences. I intercepted your ticket and will ask a few more questions, ask for additional details so I can make a proper bug report, file it and discuss with the Komplete Kontrol team.

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,939 admin

    Well @nico5 Thanks a lot for jumping in that thread, that was super helpful. I'm going to contact you by email to get more info as well to add to the bug report.

  • KierD
    KierD Member Posts: 22 Member

    I have started a bug report over at Centercode. Thanks for replying to my ticket @Jeremy_NI

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,939 admin
    Answer ✓

    @nico5 @KierD Thnaks to your information I was able to reproduce the bug, filed it under the reference KBDSW-8070 and forwarded to our devs.

  • nico5
    nico5 Member Posts: 108 Advisor

    @KierD and @Jeremy_NI

    Thanks to both of you for confirming that you could reproduce my observations in your respective setups.

    In my current setup it's easier to keep the MIDI IN connected at all times, so now I'm simply keeping my external device powered down until after the S61 MK3 is fully booted up. That seems to also be a viable short term work-around.

  • KierD
    KierD Member Posts: 22 Member

    An important update for you both @Jeremy_NI and @nico5

    I've been working today on the assumption that connecting (or starting up) my external synth to MIDI IN after the KSM3 has booted will result in reliable operation, and while that is true for a while, after an indeterminate period, the MIDI IN goes dead again and I have to reboot the KSM3 with the external synth disconnected to get MIDI transmission working again.

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