When will you update the GUI on Machine and Komplete control without requiring binoculars!
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It was (paraphrasing our NI Matthew), de-prioritising of less important feature requests 🤣
I’m not saying that lack of HiDPI is the biggest issue with NI software and I’m sure it will come eventually to KK and Maschine. But chasing down every single person who asks about it with pitchforks is a bit too radical, IMHO.
If NI didn’t want to do something about it, the option to scale Massive GUI (a legacy plugin, after all) would have never happened. It’s a bit blurry when scaled, but it helps tremendously if one is using HiDPI display. I actually started to use it again, because of that.
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"If NI didn’t want to do something about it, the option to scale Massive GUI (a legacy plugin, after all) would have never happened. It’s a bit blurry when scaled, but it helps tremendously if one is using HiDPI display. I actually started to use it again, because of that"
Yeah - I admit I found that one strange. I tried it and it is still blurry. But glad the HiDPI folks got something.
VP
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I am more or less with you on all of this except the curved monitor use (I really hate those). I too want to have a vertical monitor setup for document typing and stuff but I need to first weld a mounting fitting since the monitor neither have VESA mount nor swivel so I need something custom made or yet another monitor.
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Agree music software should be adapted for modern displays. It is 2025, not supporting it today should be considered a severe tech debt in music software development and a dangerous path towards being obsolete. NI still has a big tech debt in this regard - most NI Kontakt instruments will likely not be switched out for modern high res / scalable versions for many years. Terrible.
Laughing at the comments here on defending the use of HD and low res GUIs. Maybe show some actual empirical statistics for music production and what the attitudes actual are. I don't get it why it feels like almost a badge of honor to use a low res display. Many DAWs have switched to HighDPI and for instance I think all Arturia plugins support GUI scaling today - I am personally more excited for new Arturia products these days.
If your rig is in i specific studio HD only scenario where you haven't found a need to switch to modern displays, good for you, but consider the use cases for music production varies today. Some have media production rigs for both audio and video production duties where you tend to use 4K/5K displays, ultrawides, calibrated video monitors and studio monitors.
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It is 2024
Oh no it's not!
No one's "defending" the use of HD screens. We're just saying that they're currently the standard resolution - and they're not "low res". HD stands for high definition.
If anyone's "defending", it's the people who purchased 4K or "Retina" screens, trying to justify their purchase.
Right now 16:9 is the standard screen ratio, but in years gone by it was 4:3.
Probably when the standard was still 4:3 there were people going out and buying 16:9 screens then complaining about having black bars at the side….
😜
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My bad about the year, reflex typing, changed it. 🤣 (maybe I wish we were still in 2024?)
On the rest: Haven't seen actual receipt (actual data) on the claims, and even if you could, the use cases still varies, many users have modern displays too and most DAWs and many plugin competitors have already switched to HighDPI and GUI scaling options.
Defending owning a modern display? Grow up. Try to respect people have different rigs and use cases.
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I have an answer to all those questions:
Because they still have users accepting everything they are doing (or better… NOT doing).
I really would like them to simply think how other companies think (let’s improve our products without even the need to be forced too). But, since it’s not like this (our fault: we proved them during these years they can do whatever they want, even not fixing bugs…we buy anyway…), at least I would hope for users to show them that if they don’t keep up with others, they will fall back.
Instead, we even have users attacking other users who DARE to ask for something…
And when they noticed they were indeed falling back, instead of improving they thought to slowly abandon the products for which we fell in love with them and transforming the company from an innovating one to a “packs that cash in in short period” one…
And…guess what? Users are STILL buying…and attacking the ones who dare to ask…
Or…how someone said better…”chasing down every single person who asks about it with pitchforks”
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"I really would like them to simply think how other companies think (let’s improve our products without even the need to be forced too). "
Your intent is noble - and certainly would apply to the NI of yesteryear. But that is not going to happen with the Ni of today. Regardless of how much yammering we do in the forums here.
"At least I would hope for users to show them that if they don’t keep up with others, they will fall back."
Your logic is slightly flawed in the assumption that they "want" to keep up or even "need" to keep up.
NI has a massive worldwide user base (whether you want to believe it or not) and to have 348 users or 1656 users worldwide upset about scaling and 4K and this and that - simply does not compute. It's a rounding error. I honestly do not think for a second that this is something this company (or it's owners) would ever worry about.
And "falling back"? At this scale - you would need to lose half the user base before anyone over at Francisco Partners would be concerned - and that too will never happen.
But you did nail it with this - "Because they still have users accepting everything they are doing"
Yes - they actually do. LOTS and LOTS and LOTS of users.
It is very important to maintain perspective and remember that "we" (the forum base) represent a microscopic handful of actual users - while the other 99% of the user base (who never come here and REALLY outnumber us) could care less.
They are all just out there - using their NI stuff and making it happen (like Jon Batiste did at Super Bowl last week)
As long as NI keeps this group happy - they will do just fine.
VP
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That’s the difference between us.
If you want to “maintain perspective” (YOUR perspective)…go for it.
I know exactly that your idea is “things are like this and we cannot change it”. As I already told you years ago, making a huge exaggeration, if everyone had this type of thinking, we would still be under Monarchies because no one would have done the French Revolution. Or Hitler would rule the world (well…this is not aging well, seen the direction the world is taking…) .
What we are asking is simply not to continuously try to prove others wrong just because they ask for something you are not interested (or brave) enough to ask. Even because, in the rare cases where users succeed in obtaining something, even the others can benefit of it. Btw: not all of them are WRONG…maybe just deluded…
And maybe also not switching (as you often do) from “NI is doing the right thing because 1080p blah blah” to “they are not interested in keeping up” or “they are interested in just keeping this group happy”… Decide: are they right in doing something or they simply don’t care?
Human history (and also more recent consumers history) teach us something: sometimes “a microscopic handful” DOES bring to changes. That then are useful also to the ones that were sloth. And that “microscopic handful” is happy even for them. Unless, instead of simply being sloth, they also spent their time trying to prove them wrong…
The only pity being that those “microscopic handful of users” could simply be stronger if joined by the others. Is the typical “5 million people thinking they can’t do anything against ONE dictator”. And then 10000 overturn the regime (straining more than if they were joined by the others) and the other 4990000 join them only for the celebrations in the streets (or 4980000…there is always a handful that did agree with the dictator…)
And…no…don’t think all users of all companies are like this. NI’s ones in particular are. Lately others are showing that united they can obtain something. Last case (even if with the due proportions): Lemur midi controller users. The company set up a (very high) subscription model for their relaunch of the app. Users simply told them “Thanks, but no thanks. We will not buy it”. Casually (surely not because of this, right?) the company immediately changed his mind and sent out a “We listened to you and now you can make a one time purchase” email. So, now, the 99$ price that gave you access to a single year of use makes you own the app FOREVER. I’m quite sure the sloths that paid 99 thinking that they would have to pay 99 again next year (because “it’s like this…what can we do?”) are quite happy of the news obtained by the others, aren’t they?
A couple of betweens:
- The “NI of today” is what it is because we allow them to
- About yammering in the forum: I will ALWAYS prefer to yammer to obtain something (even maybe without any chance) than yammer against other users to just prove them wrong. ALWAYS
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The Waves subscription-only model is another classic example of this. Everyone on the beta team told them it was a really, really bad idea, but they went ahead anyway. Wasn't long before they brought back the purchase model alongside subscriptions because the use base was in uproar.
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As far as I'm aware nobody is "attacking" anyone, and the people who are simply stating the facts (of HD being the standard/common resolution) are NOT saying that NI shouldn't update their software to work better at 4K. They're just saying that 4K currently is not considered the standard resolution.
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And other users probably love their ultrawides which at certain sizes probably have to be curved. I have a curved 5K Ultrawide with multiple HighDPI DAWs.
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While 4K was made the subject of the discussion in the initial post then to me the discussion would have been better had it been about HDPI and scaling in general rather than just about 4K.
I have seen very serious program scaling issues on my computers while using what in Windows were the recommended by Windows scaling setting, even to a degree where the (not N.I.) apps either could not install or could not work. So I fully agree with PK The DJ that it would be nice if N.I. and others would update the HDPI functionality of all their apps. But I also agree with more others here when they think that the number of users that uses 4K for music making is maybe not the majority and that distribution of the number of users with respect to monitor resolution used is maybe still wider distributed.
Also I too think that it would be so great and cool if we could all sit with huge extremely high resolution monitors and run all sorts of programs and plugins at very high resolutions and that it would all scale and behave nicely including at 4K resolution (but why stop there and not go 8K ? 😁) .
But while this is not meant in anyway shape or form as an attack then when I read discussions such as this then I personally can not help thinking on not that many years ago where for me at least then rather often this or that program crashed , including my cheap 'DAW' and in fact then there is still a lot of software that does not play that nice or not at all with e.g. VST3. So when I am sitting with my programs and what not then I am actually often impressed and happy with the software for just being relatively stable so to me then as long as the software generally works as intended and do not crash then I am a relatively happy software user and to me then as far as music software goes then e.g. better 4K GUI scaling is still a luxury, a would be very nice to have luxury but still a luxury.
Also , and come to think of it then I am a little surprised that no one ever mentions this when claiming that 2160P (4K) is a widely used monitor resolution for music production, then how often do we see UW 2160P monitors ? I mean I am using a 1440P UW monitor that in my opinion were very cheap (else I would not have had the money) and I doubt that I am going to be able to get/afford an UW 2160P monitor any time soon. I found this discussion over at Reddit from a year ago with a picture that say that LG were not making OLED Ultrawides UW 2160P 240 HZ panels until second half last year , and to me at least then that signifies that maybe 2160P is not as widely used yet as some people think. The person that made the Reddit post are using a 21 : 9 monitor with a standard resolution same as mine : 3440 x 1440 and clearly says : Currently using the Alienware QD-OLED DWF variant and absolutely love it and will never go back to 16:9 .
And on top of that than I am not sure what display adapters that people will have to use to drive all this at high resolutions (2160P) even if 'only' for music making. But I am rather sure that present prices for both monitors and graphics cards/display adapters are at a place where yes maybe some have the money but most people do not.
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Cubase is marketed with ultrawides in mind at least since Cubase 11 so we are talking about half a decade. Quite long.
Sidenote: We see Apple VR is starting to use ultrawide formats, at least indicating Apple exploring the format, making it not impossible for the next Studio display to be an ultrawide. But remember the current "cheaper" flat 27 inch Apple studio display already have a resolution of 5120 × 2880.
Your opinion what YOU THINK used is not really a valid argument, people have different needs and music software devs now develop software for 5K/4K displays - welcome to the future. It also feels like your are not very updated on computers to navigate these arguments. A modern iPad can run a 4K display today.
Plugins not working well on older system? You can always have low performance version (eco versions) for large templates and older system on modern plugins. Ask for this instead of questioning why plugins should be updated. Also ask for legacy plugins to be supported longer if it is important.
All Arturias FX products for instance have highres GUI scaling, I have not seen any reviews complaining about this. If you think this is an issue, please provide these reviews.
NI is about a decade behind with many products in tech debt in regards to GUI scaling and it will probably take another decade until all instruments in the Komplete bundle with Kontakt instruments support working GUI scaling. However this could be sped up if NI start to provide more mid life cycle upgrades with the NI partners (sequels, deluxe editions etc). Play series, Piano series, Drum series, Symphony series, there are a lot of series which could do well with some mid cycle refreshing, either free or as upgrades.
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But remember the current "cheaper" flat 27 inch Apple studio display already have a resolution of 5120 × 2880.
That has to be the first time I've seen "cheaper" and "Apple" in the same sentence !!
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