Q&A with the creators of Noire, Claire, and the new Claire: Avant piano
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Hey Adrien,
thank you for your input. We are going to look into this and address it in an update. Please read our answer to dickiefunk above for more details on this.
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Hey Markrosoft,
thank you for your remarks and questions.
Regarding the releases on CLAIRE: Please give us some time to look into it and address the issue in an update. Please read our answer to dickiefunk above for more details on this.
Regarding the overtones: We're not quite sure, what you are experiencing. So you are not referring to the "Richness", the "Overtones" or the "Resonance", correct? You are using the close-mic only and just pressing a key. If so, what you hearing is the recording of a key being pressed on the original instrument. From A-1 to E0, there is only a single string per key, starting from F0, the instrument has two strings per key (moving to three strings from A#0 upwards). So from F0, there is interaction in the vibration of multiple strings. Of course, this is no different to other pianos, but depending on the string length, materials, construction, etc. there is a sound difference. But in the case of the Fazioli F308, this is the clear and vibrant sound of the instrument (at least from our perspective).
On CLAIRE: Avant, the string interaction depends on the chosen articulation. For example, Damped Una Corda has the second (and third) strings muted and therefore reacts differently. Same goes for the plucked articulations as those are played on single strings.0 -
Hey Adrien,
please find our answer on this in the reply to dickiefunk above.
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Hey TopoTone,
thank you for reaching out. This is a tricky one and I think this is a question that no one can answer for you. As you mention the CFX and NOIRE as your go-to pianos, one could argue that you simply like the Yamaha CFX sound. But judging from the instrument models alone, NOIRE and the CFX seem to be redundant. For us, however, this is not true as the CFX sounds very different to NOIRE.
NOIRE and CLAIRE share a similar engine and similar features with CLAIRE offering more detail (26 velocities of CLAIRE compared to 22 of NOIRE for instance) and more sound options (CLAIRE features an extended Particles Engine or new features like Richness). The main difference, though, is the piano itself. A Yamaha CFX (NOIRE) has a very different sound character and sound philosophy compared to a Fazioli F308 (CLAIRE). Additionally the intonation of the instrument can push the piano’s timbre into a certain tonal direction and is an art of itself. That said, a different timbre of a piano (frequency, color, punch, sustain, clarity …) changes its musical impact within an arrangement. So the preferred piano might change depending on the musical style and the musical arrangement. (Saying that, CLAIRE offers an additional dimension as you can blend between close and two room microphone perspectives).
So the point of having different pianos lies in their different tonal character and, as a consequence, especially their musical effect within a musical arrangement or mix.
Now, as it’s pretty hard to describe the different tonal colors of NOIRE and CLAIRE we’d suggest to check out some of the walkthrough or demo videos out there of CLAIRE and NOIRE. I think there are also some videos on Youtube comparing NOIRE and CLAIRE soundwise, so at least this would be a start...Having demo versions of Kontakt instruments would be amazing and this has been a topic almost as old as Kontakt. I think there are technical limitations and this is why NI was not able to realize it (yet?). Definitely a topic for NI and something for their user survey.
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Hey MLARS,
thank you for the follow-up.
Regarding the midi cc: We are still not that sure what you mean, sorry:( As we mentioned before, the "midi learn" / assign system has changed. Even if you don't use midi learn on the front end, the other way to assign a midi cc to a parameter was to drag the cc from the "Midi Automation" menu onto a UI parameter. This does not work the same way due to technical restrictions. The new workflow is to click on "Learn" (below the midi cc list in the "Midi Automation" tab), send the desired midi cc from the hardware (or daw) and move the desired control on the ui. There's a little video attached… We did not set up NOIRE in a different way, maybe that's why we are a bit confused over here. Is there a specific parameter you would like to assign to a midi cc?
Regarding the life cycle management: I totally agree with you on that one, but it's a bit more tricky than it might seem. There is the backwards compability we have to take into account and also the availability of graphic assets we need to create the Komplete UI versions. As we are a team of three, this is quite a huge task to tackle. However, having your feedback here is very valuable and it will surely trigger talks with NI on how to approach this.
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@dickiefunk @Adrien B @Markrosoft The issue with release sample decay times is addressed in Claire version 1.0.1. The update is now available in Native Access:
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I like being able to create aleatoric clouds with guitars (and other instruments). At the moment I have some sounds I created with guitar samples processed with Padshop using granular and spectral resynthesis to get this effect but the particles engine seems to offer another way to get similar results but that preserves more of the integrity of the instrument sound and is less smeary. You also have a lot more control over the position and motion vector of each ‘particle’.
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MIDI CC drag and drop editing needs to return
Problem is I do not always have all MIDI CC controllers attached so this is a predicament - older Kontakt instrument support the traditional drag and drop way of assigning MIDI CC on parameters (drag and drop is also way faster when setting up big templates). I suggest partners (and customers) ask the NI dev team to fix the MIDI CC editor page (the entire Kontakt 8 classic GUI needs an update tbh).I can confirm the tiny on/off buttons (which I didnt think would work, not identified when I first tried to drag and drop) seems to work when I try it your way with the learn button, but it is way too messy we need the drag and drop version like we had before (this is not a feasable way to assign MIDI CC at orchestral template scale). NI needs to fix Kontakt 8 with improved MIDI CC editing. It does however look the the mic menu on the Claire seem to be lacking Midi CC switching or I cannot get it to work, so some parameters might need another passthrough.
Both NI need to improve MIDI CC assignment on new Kontakt 8 instrument and partners needs to be vigilant for issues like improving UX for dragging and dropping MIDI CC assignments on new instruments.
Sorry cannot test Claire more fully but I hope this at least get the ball rolling for calibrating the user experience for both Kontakt 8 dev team and GI dev team. The Kontakt Midi CC editor needs an upgrade.
Update: and to be clear I will likely avoid buying new instruments until Kontakt has been improved considerably - so please, push NI to do better.
Life cycle management
Happy to hear. LFG mode on this one, please. Expect a "Grandeur Classic" and a "Grandeur Neo" in the near future 😉
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thanks for your answer, but the problem il still here after this update ! As we are several to talk about it also in this forum :
https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/38683/claire-bugs-and-problems-that-ive-found
Thank you
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Hello,
Are there any plans to address the half -pedaling and re-pedaling features for Claire? When enabling this, the pedal still functions like an on/off switch, and proper re-pedaling and half-pedaling do not work.
I have a VPC1 and I use it extensively with Noire, Granduer, Maverick, etc. Half-pedaling and re-pedaling work fine for these instruments.
However, this is not functioning correctly for Claire. The update from a few months ago didn't address this.
There have been other users besides myself whom have brought this up however, I'm not sure if it's been reported on the Native instruments forum. I believe it's been talked about over on pianoclack, and vi-control.net.
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Hey Kai,
thank you for stepping in. Unfortunately, the release issue still seems to exist as our update in December was too cautious. We already had another look over here and we will be addressing this issue.
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Hey Kymeia,
ok, I understand. Yes, particles can be a great sound design tool. Let's connect via email, so maybe I can give you a workaround for adding your samples and maybe achieving what you are trying to do. I know that others have done this in the past, but it is quite a manual process... You can reach me via feedback [at] galaxy-instruments [dot] com
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Hey MLARS,
thank you for the insight into your workflow. I totally agree that the old midi cc assignment was more practical in some cases, but I don't know, if Komplete UI will allow the same implementation. However, I'm sure that the Kontakt team will be made aware of this and they will find a solution (maybe even a better one?). As for the room mic-selection menu, it is not possible to assign a midi cc to a dropdown menu. This is not due to Komplete UI as the same goes for the dropdown menus in NOIRE using the old method.
We will definitely collect the issues brought up in this thread and have a conversation with NI.1 -
I really like Noire piano a lot! Are there any plans to get it to respond to soft pedal?
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Hey Adrien,
yes, the update was to cautious with regards to the release sample implementation, but we will address it as we stated before.
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