[NKS] Freelance Soundlabs 3rd Party NKS Libraries for Komplete Kontrol / Maschine

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  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
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    Yeah, strap on your waiting cap and get comfy because it's going to be a loooong while before I have everything updated, unless I just quit in frustration because it's a hell of a lot of work and since none of this affects me on Windows it's just not as high a priority as making NKS for new instruments especially when I just don't want to even sit and test it. All I will test is if it loads VST3 on Windows, then mac users can just tell me if it works for them because CBF installing everything on my mac to test, and it's not an M1 anyway.

    So will get done, just without any enthusiasm on my end!

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 252 Newcomer
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  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
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    It's a bit more complex and in-depth than this.

    There are Pros/Cons to both PC/Mac and it can be argued until the cows come home what is the better choice..... for an individual.

    Having used both for years and loving aspects of each for what it is good at I can say a Mac is far better for more novice computer users who really have no time or interest to learn about hardware, with a mac computer you just select a model and order it, like a car, but windows could come on any hardware which could be unsuitable in some cases for your needs so it can be a challenge to even know where to start.... I mean I did months of research to build a new machine and by the end of that, new hardware was out which I had to research again.

    You end up paying for this simplicity in design tho. It is worth that cost for some people to pay more for hardware that works and is designed to go together. Apple know this full well which is why they have some of the highest markups for things on the planet and it was built from the ground up to be a marketing company first.

    I choose Windows for my production work because I like to take my time with projects, I have a family that comes before it and I'd like to open a 13 year old project one day and finish it off.... No way in hell that will work on macOS so I stick to Windows. It is also far easier to do some custom and hacky things in and I also like to play games which is something macs just gave up on basically, "serious people don't play games, they get busy...."

    I understand (all too well) the frustrations from a user side, a support side and a dev side and know it will eventually settle down, just a lot of problem roads have all converged at once. People just have to have both patience at the moment, especially mac users waiting for AS to come to everything. It has been a few years now but it will still be a few more years.

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 252 Newcomer
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  • trusampler
    trusampler Member Posts: 76 Helper
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    That's the whole problem Apple breaks compatibility often. I can't recall an issue with a windows cpu, where it just wouldn't work,even the switch from 32 bit to 64 was completely smooth many years ago.

    Through time, more advanced users catch on, and end up leaving Apple. I was an Apple user for many years, and frankly got sick of them doing their 1-2 AND FINALLY UNDERSTOOD, THEY BREAK COMPATIBILITY the same reason they got caught for intentionally slowing down iphone speeds.

    Their entire business model is setup to make you upgrade to their next best thing. The problem with NOT CALLING them out, is it indeed does slow down developers from refining products, as their too busy doing bug fixes, or trying to completely rewrite code just to make what worked last year, work on the newer mac's. ;)

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
    edited November 2022
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    Yeah, probably not a discussion that needs to be hammered out here, it's a little OT. Happy to discuss in its own thread, just know that shortly it will be another Mac vs PC discussion that no one ever fully gets across their POV.

  • trusampler
    trusampler Member Posts: 76 Helper
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    True! You're right

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
    edited November 2022
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    Well, this is $h!t

    I spent weeks testing a method to update plugins from VST2 to VST3 and had everything working just fine using the KK Beta, I was able to easily switch all Spectrasonics to VST3 and have it load with a simple batch process.

    I have just started on this today and of course we have a problem

    While the VST3 plugin loads it throws this error and the preset is not loading. I have no idea why, 2 machines I have here which I have not changed a thing with Omnisphere, the only change is I am not using the Beta version of KK but now the official 2.8.

    This is a great example of why you never use a Beta to do actual important work because something has changed and funnily enough itb appears to have changed after I shared some info on the Beta forums with users on how it may be possible to update VST2>VST3 and this is exactly why I don't give out too much info on what I know or how I do things because every time I do, something gets harder to do.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
    edited November 2022
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    Seems every test I have done previously using the Beta is not working now. Something has been done in the last release which has caused an issue now with converting anything. Every test I do now loads the plugin but fails to load the preset, it just either loads empty or throws an error.

    I'm a little over it at the moment and re-evaluating my decision to even press on any further but will take a step back and look into this further a little later as I know it works, just need to track down what this latest problem is.

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 3,959 mod
    edited November 2022
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    Jason maybe wait until developers sort out migration, you don't need to feel you have to fix everything, it really is their responsibility. I am certainly letting go of the idea of using KK as a preset librarian till migration is more widely available and mainly focusing on the control aspects for now. I am sure you have enough to do in developing NKS packs for VST3 plugins (particularly all those that are VST3 only) but maybe hold off on the VST2-3 conversions that may be superfluous anyway once migration is more of a thing.

    Another thought is we both know some plugins do migrate but have out of sync params - just posted a fix for the Valhalla ones but the Korg collection also has that problem and I can't publicly post a fix for that as these were your NKS versions - fixing those in the VST3 version within KK may be easier and less prone to these sort of errors than using a text or hex editor so maybe adopt a triage like approach and fix what is more easily fixable first?

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 3,959 mod
    edited November 2022
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    btw just tested a working fix for the Korg collection VST3s - sent you a ZIP ;)

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
    edited November 2022
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    Yeah thanks for the updates, i'll get to these in time. I have to do some extra things on my end when I update such as update the info test in the files to update versioning, update documentation, update web pages.... Loads of work and currently I don't even have Korg installed on my new system. I'll get to it soon.

    It's a hard one for me to simply sit and wait for devs to do anything. If that were the case i'd have thrown my KK keyboard in the river years ago as I am still waiting on several very basic and key features asked about 6+ years ago!! I know macOS users are very use to waiting, it's an endless game of waiting for compatibility, but I am not the type to sit and wait, I want problems solved now!

    The other reason is although I can say "this isn't my mess, why should I have to invest more of my time redoing the same stuff over again just because of M1 compatibility..." fact is this does not stop the endless stream of the same questions I get asking "when M1" so i'd like to at least get under way so I can provide some more realistic timeframe than "between now and the end of time..."

    I have actually managed to find the issue that has been introduced causing my update plan to fail (something that was interestingly enabled after the Beta by the looks). All I will say is it's a strange spanner that's been thrown in the works which appears to be something that is specifically designed to make updating NKS files difficult.... Not impossible tho since an experienced eye and a Hex Editor can track down the reason with enough time and I have managed to find this new "protection" mechanism.

    I have things working again and can update libraries such as Spectrasonics easily and hope to start doing this next week. FYI I have been back and forth with Spectrasonics who did not mention migration is planned but did "pass it on to the devs" and as usual, they were very helpful and open with things including some info that at least confirmed some of the issues I was having with upgrading and their thoughts on it, Spectrasonics plugins will be the first ones updated since that is the largest amount of work if I had to manually do it for VST3, Keyscape alone requires every preset to be mapped and saved by hand as there is no way to automate this so that would be a month of work right there.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
    edited November 2022
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    Now Available: Roland Cloud AIRA & SRX Series

    These bundles are now available for the Roland series of instruments with all the bells and whistles.

    Yes, Zenology will also be released soon and I will have some updates to release for some issues discovered in some instruments within the Legendary series. Some missing presets in SoundCanvas (which isn't available to mac users as there is no VST3 version of it) and some presets that appear to be set to +24 pitch.

    If you have discovered any other issues or have any suggestions, now is the time to send these through to me via PM here or just using the Contact form on my site as it will be many months before another update.

    Steinberg Plugins are Coming...

    I have been asked so many times over the years to support Halion, Padshop, Retrologue and have started work on these. Basically whatever is included in the Absolute 5 bundle will be available initially. Unsure if I will consider expansion content at this stage but the core ones I have been asked for are already being processed.

    VST3 Updates & Releases

    I am updating all info on my website as I cross check things between PC/Mac where possible and will be putting some updated info in the first few posts here to cover the status of VST3 migration of NKS presets.

    There are a few different situations here that users need to be aware of and just because something is now working with VST3 does not automatically mean it works with Apple Silicone, do your homework.

    Libraries that I manage will be classed with the following "compatibility" notice for libraries depending on what kind of compatibility can be offered:

    • VST2 = Supports VST2 only
    • VST3 = Supports VST3 only
    • VST2/3 = Library supports "Migration" and will support VST3 automatically if VST2 is not installed
    • VST2 or VST3 = A separate library is available for EITHER the VST2 or 3 version

    Developer Enabled VST2 > 3 Migration (VST2/3)

    This kind of migration means the developer has enabled within their VST3 plugin the ability to be loaded if the VST2 plugin does not exist. This is ideally what all developers should be doing BUT this does NOT mean NKS files will work in the same way.

    What we have discovered is that in may instances, NKS files will load the plugin fine and the preset loads as expected but the controls mapped in the NKS template no longer control the plugin. This requires a new controller map to be created for these libraries for the VST3 side so please do not contact me saying "my plugin is loading but the controls do not work", We know.

    If the controls do not work between the VST2/3 plugin versions then a whole new library will be created that supports VST3 separate and this will be treated as a VST2 or VST3 library.

    VST2 or VST3 Library

    This will mean that a separate library is available for VST2 or VST3 compatibility and typically you will only install one or the other. Instructions on what library type and how to install the one you need will be included.

    VST2

    Quite simply means the library only supports VST2. If a VST3 version of the plugin exists then it will likely be updated in time. If no VST3 version exists then it cannot be updated. Even if a VST3 version exists, if the plugin is old and unlikely to receive Apple Silicone updating then it may not be updated either.

    VST3

    Library supports only the VST3 version of the plugin. As of the Roland Cloud bundle, moving forward ALL libraries will now be released as VST3 and there will no longer be a VST2 version of a library, I won't consider making VST2 library versions any longer.


    You can see the full list of plugins supported and the current support state in This Thread Post

  • arfy
    arfy Member Posts: 2 Member
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    Very nice! More Roland cloud. However, I note that SRX orchestra seems to be missing at the moment? Just curious why this is.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,678 Expert
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    Yeah you are right to be curious. Reason is: I completely overlooked it somehow which I'm not all that surprised about, there's a LOT of content to work through and I've just dug around all my library files and templates and appears I didn't even create a project folder/script for that one so I must have skipped over it and thought it had been done.

    That will be included in the next update I should be doing in a few weeks.

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