How can I solve unstable Kontakt 7 Licening on my 3. (Dual-CPU)Server-Samplelibrary-Slave-PC

Options
fahl5
fahl5 Member Posts: 25 Member
edited May 28 in Kontakt

I am owner of the current Komplete Collector Edition. I also have always had an additional Kontakt-Licens which I recently updated to Kontakt 7. I have recently bought a third PC for my Setup. It is a Server-PC with Dual-Xeon-CPU and 256GB RAM to come along with a large Amount of Orchestral Samplelibraries.
As far as I am informed, a third PC in the Setup cant be a Problem when working with the Collector-Edition especially when another additional Kontakt Licens was recently updated to Kontakt 7.

But since Month I have a severe issue with instability of the Kontakt Licening-System. The first Support-Request Answers and researches led me to the workaround to delete or replace the current Native Access.xml in the Folder "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Native Instruments\Service Center". That has helped for some times. But finally does not solved the Problem at all. I already have a directlink to that folder on my Screen and do delete more and more often without satisfying result the Native access File (including restart of the System and restart of Native Access). In so far I do have the impression, that there must be a bug which prevents me to make use of my license of Kontakt 7 and the Libraries I have licensed for it.

It is a pitty, that Native Instruments has closed their personal Support-Section, which I have expirienced in many years to be very efficient, serious and helpfull. The current Bot system just do not understand anything at all about the Problem I have and I would be very lucky, if anyone in the comunity would have the time to read the full post, think about the possible Reason of the Problem and is able to make constructive suggestions for a solution, but however, I still believe a professional personal support would be the right adress for problems like that and I hope Native Instruments would keep up the quality of Suport I am used to get previously.

kind regards

Steffen

Best Answer

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Customer Care Posts: 10,396 mod
    edited May 28 Answer ✓
    Options

    @fahl5 There is already other threads you started. I'm closing this one as it's going nowhere and you're just complaining and arguing with people that are just here to help out. You are in contact with our support, they will get back to you.

«1

Answers

  • PoorFellow
    PoorFellow Moderator Posts: 3,686 mod
    edited May 9
    Options

    First of all , I am trying to help here , I am not an N.I. employee and I have no stake in this , hence the following is for information purposes only and only to try to assist as best I can.

    As I see it then from what you write then only support can help you. When approaching support then please be aware of exact license conditions. (I have pasted quotes below here) .

    My own personal take on fixing the problem with respect to you from description having both a full "Komplete Collector Edition" and "an additional Kontakt-Licens which I recently updated to Kontakt 7" then I don't expect there to be any easy fix for your predicament other than moving the 'surplus' licenses to another account and run it by logging into that separate account. Again , I am just trying to help and what I write is based on my experiences here. At an earlier occasion when trying to engage someone in charge of N.A. in a license matter problem then it were not met with any greater interest. So , yes , you might be a 'good customer' but your problem is a fringe one and there are too much else much more important for N.I. and developers to get fixed. So while I will advice you to approach support and I will place link/instructions below then if I were you then I would not hold my breath waiting for any real permanent other solution than what has been suggested by me. (I understand that most likely your setup requires it all to act within one account and that my suggestion most likely does not really work for you)

    N.I. Native Access and Installation Support

    At the page N.I. Native Access and Installation Support be sure to scroll down to page bottom to see if there is a log-in request , if there is then log-in , at next page again scroll down and small blue chat box ought occur within 15 seconds. Then write in chat box and when getting suggestions then select did not help when it didn't , that ought to bring you on to either chat with human or open a ticket.

    There has been introduced chat support for Native Access assistance (at least daytime on normal work days) :

    Please refer to the page : How to get in touch with our Customer Care or read my Support page functionality changes post here

    License info : Quote ADDITIONAL INFO :

    All products included within a single edition of a KOMPLETE 14 bundle are part of one user license and can only be used as a single entity. A maximum of three installations on three machines are allowed as long as only one installation is used at any given time. The individual products cannot be resold separately.

    Ref. : Quote : END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT , section : 3.3

    Licensee may install and personally use the licensed software on three devices (e.g. one computer, one laptop, one workstation), provided that the said software is used only on one device regularly. Simultaneous use on more than one hardware device is not permitted. The Products may not be used on a network by multiple users, unless each user possesses a license. In case Licensee changes the hardware, all software on the hardware used must be deleted.

  • fahl5
    fahl5 Member Posts: 25 Member
    edited May 9
    Options

    Thank you for your comprehensive Answer. But the Sugestion to use the second Kontakt Licens from another Account would mean, that I have to switch with all the libraries I intend to use with it also on a second account. What means, I could in future only use a certain Libraries on a certain PC and not (as it is possible from the licening conditions) on different PC's as long as I do not use them simultaneously. So im my opinion it definitly makes very much sense to urge Native Instruments to make the two payed licenses work as they are sold to work: independently and simultaneously from the same Account. After all I dont like to make things even more complicated with additional Fake Accounts. I am clear and I think that will make it for all easier to react also clear and honest.

  • PoorFellow
    PoorFellow Moderator Posts: 3,686 mod
    Options

    What means, I could in future only use a certain Libraries on a certain PC

    Thank you , yes I had understood that something like that would be your situation/position

    So im my opinion it definitly makes very much sense to urge Native Instruments to make the two payed licenses work as they are sold to work: independently and simultaneously.

    Yes , my wishes for 'good luck with that' 🙂 🤔

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Customer Care Posts: 10,396 mod
    Options

    @fahl5 You are already in contact with my colleagues from Support. I'm not sure if your setup "(Dual-CPU)Server-Samplelibrary-Slave-PC" is actually supported. My colleague replied to you earlier today, please get back to him, there is not much more we can help you with here.

  • fahl5
    fahl5 Member Posts: 25 Member
    edited May 27
    Options

    "already in contact", that is a joke nearly 3 Weeks after the Problem began to occur and was reported to me. And btw.: like in the very few (2-3) Answers before, there is still literally nothing in this "Answer" which shows any in depth investigation of anything I have documented, more over are there Links to Microsoft Windows 10 Supportpages, while it is clear since weeks, that the Problem occurs on a Dual-Xeon Win 11 Pro Workstation. Questions about the Version number of Plugin and Standalone shows, that this Answer also completely ignores the few Questions and responses which were included in the poor previous "Answers" as well as all Screenshots which already easily gave a visual answer to this question before it was posed by this so called "Technical Support". And no, this Problem might be more than simple FAQ-Links can solve. But a good technical support should be able to understand, when a problem might be founded in shortcomings of the Software itself. How else should a development section improve their Product, if not with taking care for the problems which occurs. And that the Native-Instrument-Authentication system a License-Management does not reflect the possibility that the same User might use a certain software more than on one System simultaneously. This is a real Problem especially as far Kontakt is meant to be a platform for the most available Samplelibraries on the market, which of course might be easily to much to be load all on a single system when you combine several of the most developed Libraries. So please just begin to take my Support-Request as serious as it deserves for a paying customer.
    And if you really think, that your Product is not at all able to work in a setup with one Host and two Slave-Pc's (which ist since Years not that unusual when working with larger orchestral Libraries), why is Native-Instrument than not decent enough to state clear, that even if an installation on up to three PC's is explicitly allowed for Komplete CE-User, Kontakt is currently simply not able to be used in such a Network-Setup and refund me for a product, you can not deliver in the way it is meant to work. That would at least be kind of decent, but simply ignoring or answer

  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 1,238 Guru
    edited May 27
    Options

    @fahl5

    "Why is Native-Instrument than not decent enough to state clear, that even if an installation on up to three PC's is explicitly allowed for Komplete CE-User, Kontakt is currently simply not able to be used in such a Network-Setup"

    This is VERY clear:

    The only thing that is really not clear (at all) is your assumption that while you can install the software on three computers - you can only USE one of those three installed licenses at one time.

    This requirement has been in places for literally years.

    VP

  • fahl5
    fahl5 Member Posts: 25 Member
    Options

    No I fear you simply miss the crucial point. The question is not how often you can install and use "one" License. That is pretty clear: even if you can install K7 on up to three PC's you can use only "one installation at any given time".
    But: if you need more Kontakt 7 to be used simultaneously you obviously need to have as much licenses as you want to "use at any given time" to respect the Licens conditions. There can be no other reason to allow to buy further K7 Licenses if you already have one or even two in my case, than to allow to use more Kontakt at a given time as would be covered by a single License. (For Exsample if you want to use Vienna Ensemble on more than one PC, you also have to buy more Licenses and than you can use more Installations "at a given time" simultaneously.)
    But obviously neither Native Instruments nor their Native Access seem to be ready to assign a certain Licens transparent and reliable to a certain system, as you can do for instance in ILok without Problem. And thus it makes no sense to allow the purchase of additional Licenses, if they are not at all able to let the Customer use them. Either they should rule out customers who are trying to buy additional Licenses for simutaneous use of the same Software on multiple Systems over one Account, or they should care for, that the user gets for what he has payed: another working Licens of Kontakt. But currently they are on the one hand opbviously not able or willing to allow the usage of multiple Licenses of the same Software, but go on to sell them as if a cutomer who already have one Licens, would be able to use it, what is obviously wrong. And not being honest in this case, that a customer should not be able to buy more than one License, this is my Eyes simply not decent. They should of course refund me, if they are not ready to sell working second or third licenses but nevertheless sell them as if they were usable. It is a mess, and the better way out would be to get the System to be capeable of the asignment and use of multple Licenses.

  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 1,238 Guru
    edited May 27
    Options

    I do not believe I am not missing the crucial point - NI licenses have always been "single licensed instance via a single NI account" for as long as I have been a customer (2002)

    The "point" here is that there is no concept (and never has been) of setting up a server farm and utilizing x number of "extra" licenses (under the same NI acct) as you are trying to do.

    While I totally understand your "need" to do this - NI has stated your scenario is not supported.

    Not sure what else you want but one thing is certain - a long rant on what you "think" this should look like - probably won't help the situation.

    VP

  • fahl5
    fahl5 Member Posts: 25 Member
    Options

    Nothing you quoted excluded in any way to buy and use more than one Licens (which is something absolutly normal for nearly every other product in the market). No one is talking about "server Farms" but about simple Host-Slave-Networks of two or three Systems, for which Vienna Ensemble is made since more than and decade. And: If NI would not support the possession, why ever did they still make possible to buy more than one Licens. It would be pretty simple to restrict buying more than one Licens for one Account (as they do with Updates and Upgrades for those who "qualify") on those who dont already own a Licens for one certain Product. My Point is, they have sold me a third licens, but are not ready to let me use what I have payed for. So either they refund me ("sorry we sold something, what we cant provide. Get your Money back") or they provide what they have sold (Sorry, of course we manage to allow you to use what we already took your Money for"). Everything else is more likely to Fraud than to any kind of justified decent behavior. Not sure what else you think, but after nearly three weeks without any constructive reaction, a lont rant is simply what they absolutly deserve, to understand, that delaying Non-Support" is simply awful ****** and anything, but of course not the correct reaction on their mistake.

  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 1,238 Guru
    edited May 28
    Options

    “They have sold me a third license, but are not ready to let me use what I have payed for.”

    “They” did not sell you anything. You bought it. Big difference.

    And there is nothing wrong with this licence. It works and does what it says on the tin.

    It appears you do not like the fact that you bought another licence but are suddenly shocked about the conditions in which you need to use this license.

    While I do understand your frustration with not getting any support for several weeks, this whole thing could have been avoided by asking a few questions here in the forums before buying that license.

    There are lots of folks around here that would have offered you some help.

    VP

  • fahl5
    fahl5 Member Posts: 25 Member
    Options
    1. again there is no where at all stated, that it would be impossible to use a second License on the same Account. To pretend that is simply wrong. It is only said what you can do with one license but nothing said about any second license. And no to buy something is always a business of two partners, one who is willing to buy and the other who offers a certain product, which he promises is able to do certain things what it is bought for: and that is just "to use it". When they sell it, while they know you cant use it without explicitly stating under which conditions it could not be used (what they do for instance in the System requirements) than it appears to me like blank deception.
    2. They also haven't said about any restrictions to use neither about any incompatibility with Dual Xeon CPU while they do so for CPU lower than i5: "i5 or equivalent CPU" if that would mean any limit above, where exactly should that be i7 ? i9? of course there is no upward limit named at all!!!
    3. I am shocked that they let me buy something, what seems to be known aas unusable. again that would be simply fraud. It is of course that they do not manage to restrict very detailed their selling on customers who "qualify" for a certain product, you can see that not only for every variation of update, upgrade or cross grade. They also do the same with the Kontakt Player Freeware, which you are not able to get ialreadyady a registered user of the Full version. (It would be interesting, if the Kontakt player behave likewise strange on multiple installation and usage as the Full Version does when you paid for multiple Licenses) So if they know only one License can be used on one Account they should prevent those who alredy have it to pay for another. But in my case they did not at all twice.
    4. And no what a completely meaningless and wrong Phrase "There are lots of folks around here that would have offered you some help" in total over 3 Weeks 4 User and one NI-Guy "answered" meanwhile none of those answers provided any real help. And how should they, if the mistake is located in restrictions and shortcomings of the NI-License-management, which are mentioned as such exactly nowhere at all whanevertheless don't keep Native Instruments from trying to cheat their existing Customers with selling products which they do not allow to be used. And this is how ever you are trying to cover up with no where stated user conditions simply wrong and a big mistake they should take the responsibility for.

  • fahl5
    fahl5 Member Posts: 25 Member
    edited May 28
    Options

    BTW.: By the way, such unpredictable "instability" of authentication is also not good evidence for the claim that it would be somehow restricted to have and use more than one license of the same software in the same account. Since Native Access often enough also let Kontakt 7 be opened as licensed either as Standalone or as Plugin or both or both not. And this behavior does not fit with any existing usage conditions at all. To be clear It is pure disfunction which makes the Product unusable for its unpredictable instability not for any existing and stated restrictions to use.

    What a really strange Idea to try to present this obviously completely weird reacting technical problem as part of any regular term of any usage conditions!!!!

  • Maciej Repetowski
    Maciej Repetowski Member Posts: 594 Guru
    edited May 28
    Options

    First of all, calling our efforts to help you “meaningless” is plain rude, unless English is not your first language and you are auto-translating.

    Second, there are many examples of multi seated, multi-account music production companies, where buying additional licenses for software and libraries to run on different computers operated by different composers/producers at the same time is perfectly viable solution. So NI is absolutely in their right to offer additional “seats” for Kontakt.

    Now, using this the way you want on a hardware configuration you have, that’s another story. Seems that they have not anticipated cases and rigs like yours. IMHO, they should offer you a refund in this case.

    I’m quite active on VI-Control forum, people there have rigs like yours (master-slave) with VEP, Kontakt and orchestral libraries, in last two years or so I haven’t heard of anyone having problems like yours - perhaps ask for help there?

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 2,842 Expert
    edited May 28
    Options

    @fahl5

    A) One may use multiple instances of NI program/library on one computer even with just single licence. It runs on one computer…. No, need for aditional licences… More licences would be needed if you need run NI SW on more than three computers or more than one user at given moment….

    B) If it did not change, NI does not support installing its products on server/NAS. The reason is sort of obvious… Many computers may have access to the server and simultaneously. Solving, up to three computers, but only one user at time could be manaegable even in this case, but simply is not supported…

    C) If it did not change, one may find way around. Sort of. You may map the server as disc and direct Kontakt, that libraries are on that "disc". It did work for people. Try search for NAS and Kontakt, you might get current info what has worked for people. (But if you have large )

    D) Another problem might be the dual CPU. NI takes sort of fingerprints of computer, hard to say what happens on two socket computers…..

    E) I have many, many duplicate licences on my single NI account. It causes absolutely no problems…. And concerning that NI did not tell you, you do not need more licences… NI cannot know, what you need it for. You may need to use it on additional computers or more than one person at time….

    ——————To sum up….Working on one computer requires only one licence even if many instances are used.IMHO primary source of your problem is using server for NI SW. Maybe that two CPU socket computer adds up additional problems…. Multiple socket computer is not common thing at all. It is used mainly for servers.Maybe it would be good to explain here, how do you use server and do on…. You do not get much support here at the forum, because it is somewhat fuzzy, where the problem lies.And concerning the allocation of a licence to certain computer. You do it by installing NI SW on that computer using Native Access. (there are other ways, but in every case one has to authorise NI SW for given computer by running NA on given computer.)

  • Maciej Repetowski
    Maciej Repetowski Member Posts: 594 Guru
    edited May 28
    Options

    Vienna Ensemble Professional (it’s a peculiar DAW/host for orchestral work) has a mode when certain parts of orchestration can be offloaded to slave computers to reduce the load on main computer. The slaves can be PCs or Macs, many people use just one slave, but it can be more of them. This is being used mostly with Vienna’s own virtual instruments and their licensing allows that. He wrongly assumed that Kontakt licensing allows that too.

This discussion has been closed.
Back To Top