Native Access Q1 Update
Comments
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That’s my main concern with how NI seems to work these days: the people taking the decisions think “let’s do it this way” (often changing things that were already working in previous versions), while everyone else thinks “WHY???”
As I said in another occasion, it seems like those cases when new managers get hired in a company and start changing things that were already tested and working previously, just because they have to show they are bringing something new and new ideas…no matter if they are worst…
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The last update session was a total shambles for me. When I clicked update, nothing seemingly happened, but at some point, when I'd stopped looking, it did start updating stuff. Another rubbish thing is that when it installs, although it comments that the programme has been installed, it doesn't update the update button till ages later. That really is confusing and very unhelpful. Have they nuked the beta testers for NA?
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Sounds like things were running a little slow. I just tested it right now with 4 updates queue all together and everything was instant including the update of the count next to "updates"
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It has never been like that for me with NA2, it's always been, at the very least, slow. (Win 10)
Just what is that busy GIF meant to indicate, and why is there no info telling the user what it is doing?
I'll be honest, I don't recall having any real issues with NA 1
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I am also on Windows 10 and my updates are between "decently fast" and "very fast" and i never had an issue with Native Access!
Of course i don't use those gigantic Kontakt libraries, the largest i have is the Factory (about 34 Gb), so if other users have to download 100 Gb libraries, of course this can not be happened instantly.
However, users must be aware that there are a lot of other important factors about speed which are not related to Native Access at all. Some of the most important, are:
- Your internet connection. Even if you have a super-fast line, i suggest to test your current speed, you might be surprised if you discover that your 100mbps line is actually performing at 35, because for example, you live in an over-crowded area, while my 50mbps line performing at 45 because there are not many people in my area! So, in reality, my "slower" line is in fact faster than your "faster" line. ;-)
- The second very important thing is, how many unnecessary tasks and background apps are running "behind the scene". In other words, how well-optimized is you computer! If you allow every single irrelevant app to run in the background without purpose, you will experience significant reduced response from your machine! Tasks without purpose are for example, a hardware update app (it might happen once in a year, yet you have it running every day!) or some Microsoft nonsense such as Telemetry tasks, or Handwriting and Biometric services (even if you do not have any device to use such services), Mobile services (even if you never connect a mobile to your computer) and so on and so one, the catalog is endless!
So, i would say that first, make sure that your computer is in top-notch condition and only then you can accurately judge if Native Access updates are fast or not.
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It can go on for minutes and minutes with me and can do it at start up too.
I don't know why, and support show little or no interest in understanding and fixing why most NI products are so terrible on my system. Both Komplete Kontrol and Maschine mostly take 8 minutes to open as they hang for 3 to 4 minutes saying waiting for product scan and then spend another 3 -4 minutes rescanning a whole bunch of plugins that shouldn't need to be rescanned. Kontakt 7 takes about 3 minutes to open in Reaper or Bitwig.
When Reaper, Bitwig or MetaPlugin and the like do product scans, they always hang on Kontakt and Komplete Kontrol for ages.
Most companies would at least show some interest in why these things are occurring...............
Whilst I try to keep my computer reasonably clean, I'm not au fait enough to be sure it's entirely optimal. If there are any apps or links explaining what can safely be dismissed that you can propose, I'd be grateful.
I have to stress though that it is only the Native Instrument products that are causing these type of problems.
Reaper, Bitwig, MuLab and all the plugin brands so far don't appear to show any real problems or loading issues.
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That’s an important point: every time someone try to blame the user computer (which is indeed a factor, but not the reason for everything) I always think “ok…but if every other product from other brands doesn’t have similar problems on the same computer but NI ones do, that should ring a bell”…
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It appears the bell is possibly silent 😅
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Let’s give it a voice then
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"Both Komplete Kontrol and Maschine mostly take 8 minutes to open as they hang for 3 to 4 minutes saying waiting for product scan and then spend another 3 -4 minutes rescanning a whole bunch of plugins that shouldn't need to be rescanned"
This became a huge issue on my last Win 10 build as well - for my new build - I took the time to "instruct" Komplete Kontrol (under the Edit->Preferences-Plugins area) on which plugins to scan and which to not.
Took me a good 15 minutes to hack thru it but now KK opens in 4 seconds from a cold start.
I decided my requirement for this new machine needs to be efficient (but restricted) at the same time. So I went with:
"If the plugin natively appears my S61 MKII browser screen and can be selected/manipulated by the S61 for use in KKv2 - it stays".
So I only allow KKv2 to scan and "see" NKS compliant plugins and FX and that is it.
There is zero point in letting this thing scan a whole pile of say - UAD2 VST3/VST2 plugins - which serve zero purpose inside Komplete Kontrol at any time. Have not missed any of them to this point.
VP
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Although I too have a KK S61 MK 2, I haven't the space to use it at the moment and do most of my work on Maschine which hopefully one day will have a more sensible and mature Chord using facility.
You seem to be indicating that the problem lies with the way NI products deal with plugins and I would concur with that as when I migrated from my laptop to my current system, it was fine and working as it should until I finished loading all my plugins. I had thought the laptops low spec was causing the issue but as my current system is dual Xeon 8 core with hyper-threading and 48 GB of Ram, I'd like to hope it both shouldn't and isn't. Whilst you are happy to restrict which additions you use to what appear to be NKS only, I don't see any value in buying things that aren't usable because NI are seemingly the only company I have come across that is unwilling and/or incapable of solving something that isn't a problem for anyone else. With their resources, it's laughable in a very bad way that it exists and has done so for years. Users appear to be a necessary inconvenience............................
As I say, when using anything else, none of these problems appear, though when there may have been an issue with other manufacturers, they have usually bent over backwards to solve the issues, even if they weren't the cause of the problem. (Waves to the wonderful UVI)
It's a little depressing that the new ownership hasn't meant any improvement with NI's attitude to its users
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I would even dare to say it introduced worsening, sadly 😔
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"Whilst you are happy to restrict which additions you use to what appear to be NKS only, I don't see any value in buying things that aren't usable because NI are seemingly the only company I have come across that is unwilling and/or incapable of solving something that isn't a problem for anyone else"
After enduring the super long scans with my prior machine - all I wanted to do this round was be able to get to work fast and know that the plugins that would be scanned would be 100% supported on my S61 MKII.
Now - do I wish that ALL my VST3 plugs were nicely mapped for NKS and ready to go?
Sure I do - but that is not all on NI.
Let's take Universal Audio for example - while they have some truly magnificent plugins - they are the defacto industry A-holes when it comes to product installers. I own maybe 15 or 20 UA plugs - but UA insists on installing 250+ and to add insult to injury - they make sure to install ALL the VST3 plugins, ALL the now almost useless VST2 plugins and ALL the truly useless AAX plugins - every single time. There is no way to stop this - you get it all whether you want it or not. And not a single one of these is NKS.
Of course if a user allows this to stand - Komplete Kontrol will be right there - ready to scan each and every one of these things - adding minutes to every scan time.
I only took action here because of this sort of blatant space wasting nonsense makes my process slow down for no return whatsoever.
Even if I did allow KK to scan a bunch of non-NKS plugs - I realized after three years on the prior DAW - that I would never (ever) use a NON-NKS compliant plugin with my S61/KK workflow anyway - so why scan them?
I do not look at this being uniquely an NI "scan" problem (which of course - could always be better) - I look at it as a way to drastically "improve" my own scan time (and hence my work time) by taking actions only because I am not given a choice to install ONLY the UA plugins that I own.
Taking the time to cut out all these non-NKS plugs is like a breath of fresh air compared to waiting like I did a few months ago with the old DAW.
VP
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There is a script that allows you to at least hide the unused UAD plugins:
I believe someone has also done a script for uninstalling UAD plugins you only have demos of, but I can't find that at the moment, if I do, I'll post a link. (I might add that I have Ultimate 12 but when I tried the uninstal script, it totally crashed my computer.................)
I know that some manufacturers use unhelpful default installations that can accidentally introduce dupes, but I've made sure that there are only one VST 2 and one VST 3 folders in use.
The list of programs I have used with no problems on this issue are Reaper, Bitwig, MuLab, Harrison Mixbus 32, Cakewalk Free, Waveform free, New Sonic Arts Freestyle. None have any issue once the initial plugin scan is done. None of my plugins or libraries do either.
Yes, UAD and others could do a better job by not insisting on installing plugins you don't own, but as I keep repeating, it is ONLY NI products exhibiting this behaviour. If they are being cavalier about non NKS products, that is somewhat disturbing.
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