Add keyboard aftertouch support to Maschine

Kymeia · 2023-04-16T18:27:02+00:00

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This is a FR for performers and musicians who are unable to fully use their keyboard's midi expression capabilities with software instruments in Maschine due to lack of support for aftertouch. We have an absurd situation where NI 's own flagship S Series keyboards, which have pretty good aftertouch, are not fully compatible with Maschine, nor are synths like Massive X which actually has a dedicated aftertouch modulator, not to mention that almost all software and many hardware synths also support aftertouch modulation. As far as I know Maschine is the only host that actively filters it out. I know there are historical reasons for this due to poor design choices early on in its development, but it's about time this limitation was put to rest once and for all.

In my view this is essential because this isn't just causing incompatibility with current synths and limiting the ability of performing artists to use their keys expressively within Maschine (which for me means I just don't bother with it much as I would like to for soft synths), it's basically a barrier to Maschine and other NI software embracing the new generation of midi and musical expression capabilities including not just channel but also poly aftertouch, MPE, MIDI 2, and MTS-ESP and innovative keyboard controllers like Seaboard and Osmose. Please support this FR.

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Wallirec

I have a CME Xkey keyboard with aftertouch - while the machine software does not respond to this type of command

Kymeia

Oh very revealing - the new Irish Harp instrument just 'happens' to have support for both channel and poly aftertouch and appears to be the first NI instrument to make use of those new aftertouch tags in Komplete Kontrol and Maschine (even though Maschine itself still does not, yet, support either of those sources of modulation). Clearly there is some underlying plan unfolding here, like many NI freebies they are using it to test the waters.

Jdubbs75

I know this if Native Instruments doesn’t start getting their ****** together with maschine i sadly maybe heading over to ableton push.

D-One

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/69536#Comment_69536

You were the first person on the forum to predict a new keyboard was coming based on the new Poly AT tags added to Maschine, 6 months ago!

I bookmarked this thread and waited all that time just to say congrats when the time came, it's today so: Congrats! 😂 🎉

It's crazy how no one else noticed... You deserve a prize.

Kymeia

Cheers - I’m just so pleased to see the new keyboards have poly AT as I’d hoped :) I hope I am also right about the implications for Maschine too, although maybe we won’t see those immediately, otherwise it’s going to be even more out of sync with the keyboards

D-One

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/93792#Comment_93792

I'm glad you like it, the response so far seems positive. I am not sure tbh, it seems logical to add AT to Maschine because of the KKS mk3 but then again they removed all Maschine related buttons from it...

EDIT: Actually i just saw a YouTuber say "The entire integration with Maschine is gone since not many people use it" 🤷‍♂️ Sounds kind of crazy to me that it will not work with the M+.

Milkman

I certainly hope there is some sort of revamp for poly AT inside machine, and I hope the positive result is not just for those who spend more money on the new S series mk3 keyboards.

ozon

@D-One wrote

I'm glad you like it, the response so far seems positive.

Really? Most of the comments on the YT video are pretty negative.

Personally, I’d be very disappointed if that is the big thing that was announced for months…

darkwaves

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/93908#Comment_93908

I'm seeing the same on reddit. I think a subset of people commenting on it don't really see the value in polyphonic aftertouch, but it's quite a big deal IMO.

I've never considered buying one of their keyboards. I'm not currently in the market for a midi keyboard; but if I were; I'd have to consider them because I'm not seeing many full sized midi controllers out there with poly aftertouch. I'd probably end up going with a synth and have it do double duty (specifically looking at the Osmose); but NI would be in consideration.

I don't have the space for another large keyboard (even a 49 key); but I would buy a m32 with poly aftertouch without thinking twice about it. lol. I've been thinking about buying the hydrasynth explorer just to have a little portable keyboard with poly aftertouch.

macchinista

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/93955#Comment_93955

I would be delighted to see an m37 with Poly AT 😍

D-One

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/93908#Comment_93908

At the time I said that it was surprisingly positive, but now not so much, the top like comments are def on the negative side now to say the least. To me it looks cool aesthetically, i do feel a tiny bit of GAS for the new shiny thing but I'm nowhere close to being impressed enough to spend 800$ and I am not looking to go thru my KKSmk2 / M+ experience again, they would need to pay me 800$ for that 😂 Especially since this was their priority for god knows how long. I won't rant but I am not happy atm. Good luck to them.

Philippe

Apart Poly AT, the fact it seems you can get rid of KK software hosting could be a plus for me. But it probably will need plugin updates from MANY companies. So not now. And the price does not help.

Ben C

Just adding my voice to this. I have so many synths with AT as a first-class modulator, and given that we know the Mk3/M+ pads can read continuous pressure (because it's used to set the velocity of subsequent notes in Note Repeat/Arp modes), it makes little sense that the software doesn't record that data as AT in normal pad and chord modes, it's such a waste of the hardware's capability. I mean, AT seems to quite rare on MIDI keyboards at the more compact and/or affordable end of the market, so the fact that Maschine is physically able to read it actually gives it quite a selling point, which isn't being taken advantage of.

I can only guess that something in the roots of the software and the way it's written means it would be a non-trivial job to add this functionality. Someone way back when probably thought, "Well, it's primarily a beat-making tool, and AT is a feature only really useful to fairly advanced players of proper keyboards, not people tapping out basslines or synth lead melodies on pads". And there's probably some truth to the reality of playing melodic parts on pads that means AT is difficult to make proper use of, especially polyphonically, but I know I'd find it super-useful for adding expression to pads, for example.

It's also a fact that people may want to use Maschine as their DAW and hook up AT-enabled keyboards, but maybe NI think you should only use Maschine as a driver for the controller, and otherwise run it as a plug-in inside a proper DAW for anything beyond that 🤷‍♂️

EvertJG

A few weeks ago in the AMA for the new MK3 keyboards I noted the following from Matt (my bold added):

Matthew_NI Product Team Posts: 335 mod

September 18

ReefiusSep 12, 2023

I hope there will be an update for Maschine soon to support the polyphonic aftertouch of these keyboards.

I'll try and keep it focussed on Kontrol S MK3 topics. We'll talk more about Maschine later, as there are questions regarding the Kontrol S MK3 integration (there isn't one).

However, we can all understand why people have questions. Maschine has so many varied users and needs, that even though we continue to update the product (several times this year) there continue to be others disappointed in a lack of whatever features they'd asked for.

The simple answer to your question is YES. I'm looking at my desk, and a version of the existing Maschine Plus running with polyphonic aftertouch fully implemented. We hope to get this (and more features besides) to beta this year, and either release this year or early next if beta goes well.

Kymeia

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/106344#Comment_106344

It's good, but I hope this does not mean we will never get channel aftertouch support in Maschine (for series 1 and 2 keyboards and the majority of keyboards with aftertouch)

Also does Massive X support Poly aftertouch on a Series III? I don't have one to try

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