To all users who experienced crashes with Native Access 3.11.0.

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Hayo_NI
Hayo_NI Product Team Posts: 293 mod
edited May 29 in Native Access

Hi everyone,

Native Access recently released 3.11.1. This is a hotfix to address the situation where some users are no longer able to open Native Access. This was caused by an update to our build systems that unintentionally wasn't actively supporting MacOS 11 anymore. We managed to recover the issue and tested it with a user in this forum (thank you btw, was really helpful!), so we hope it fixes the issue for everyone else. To preface, this does not solve the issue with Loading Products, we're still on that but these users will be able to update to a fixed version in the future.

A note that this is a sign for us to look more closely at deprecating support for MacOS 11. Apple no longer supports it, our build systems no longer maintain it, so it's coming close to us stretching the limit of us supporting MacOS 11. We were planning to deprecate it around August, but are likely going to speed up the timeline. This is the first headsup I'll give, another coming soon.

For users who are unable to update NA due to the crash and would like to bypass it, please follow these steps:

  • Windows: Go to Add or Remove Programs, and uninstall Native Access & NTK Daemon.
  • Mac: Delete Native Access, and navigate to /Library/Application Support/Native Instruments/NTK to delete the NTK Daemon. Drag both to the bin and clear your bin.

After uninstalling the two apps, go to the Native Access homepage to install the latest version.

If this does not resolve the OS-level crash (where Apple shows a dialog that Native Access failed to open), please respond to this thread or DM me! We hope this resolves the issue.

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Comments

  • rilesmusic
    rilesmusic Member Posts: 2 Newcomer
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    Hey, I'm still having an issue. I deleted the 2 files mentioned, emptied the trash, installed 3.11.1, and restarted the computer (Mac OS 11.7.10). NA opens now but has to reinstall the NTK daemon, and just hangs with a spinning circle trying to do that – says "Installing dependencies." Really wish I could install the Evolution Series libraries I bought yesterday.

  • rilesmusic
    rilesmusic Member Posts: 2 Newcomer
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    I closed Native Access (with the hung window still spinning) and reopened it and now it seems to be working. Was able to download at least one library too.

  • SteveECrane
    SteveECrane Member Posts: 12 Member
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    Whilst the issue detailed above is a MacOS-specific one, there is an ongoing issue with Native Access across all platforms which is now well over half a year old!

    Given that these are known issues, publicly acknowledged and accepted by NI's Prod Dev team, any responsible software developer would stop releasing 'new' software - software which it has accepted as being fundamentally flawed - and would immediately curtail ANY AND ALL automatic updates which are not under the user's direct control. Why the insistence on this? Surely it's causing more work for NI, not less!?

    Furthermore, a responsible developer would re-release the latest stable version until the 'updated' software has passed Quality Control checks and no longer exhibits ANY of the already known and acknowledged tendencies.

    We, your users, are not interested in workarounds, Hot-Fixes and other such compensatory techniques which impinge on our creative, music-making and free-time!

    To do otherwise is disingenuous and disrespectful of the user's time, effort and goodwill and all ensuing apologies are merely platitudinous, mealy-mouthed, empty and worthless.

  • mykejb
    mykejb Moderator Posts: 1,321 mod
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    I just hope the "stuck in a VST3 scanning loop" in NKTDaemon will be fixed at some point!

  • DunedinDragon
    DunedinDragon Member Posts: 600 Pro
    edited May 22
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    @SteveECrane We, your users, are not interested in workarounds, Hot-Fixes and other such compensatory techniques which impinge on our creative, music-making and free-time

    I don't recall giving you or anyone authority to speak for me as a NI user. Like you I'm a Windows user and I've been using NI products and equipment quite productively every week for years on the latest versions, and have added significantly to my library of NI tools both software and hardware since the first of the year using all the latest versions. Although I'm not particularly in favor of hot fixes to remain current, I diligently install them and none of them have held up any of my "creative, music-making and free-time" efforts.

    I'm sorry you and others are having problems, but even though there's been a lot of traffic on this forum about various problems, there are likely many more like myself that are doing fine. It may be worth considering that you aren't typically hearing from us since we've got nothing to gripe about.

    Anyone with just a passing knowledge of how commercial software development works understands there is always a need for separate efforts to address transient problems while continuing development on planned future products. One doesn't negate the other and that is simply the nature of the business. I know I've received two maintenance releases of Windows in the last two weeks, but I'm sure product feature development is continuing on the platform separately as has always been the case.

    I will agree with you that users that are experiencing problems with their setups should have the ability to remove auto updates to keep their systems in a working state until they're confident about doing an update. That's only reasonable. I myself have chosen to not do an upgrade to Windows 11 because it doesn't provide any compelling features for me and I'm not willing to risk problems unless I'm sure of the benefit. The same should apply to anyone with any commercial product. I use Ableton Live 11 but again I haven't chosen to update to the newest version because it provides nothing I can see of particular benefit to my use. But the work I do every single week depends on working stability of my system and so I'm very careful about doing any updates without doing my research. That's what end users should do if they're depending on their system whether they're a single user or a fortune 500 company with a dependency on any product. That's just systems management 101.

  • MaikR
    MaikR Member Posts: 179 Pro
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    This is EXACTLY why I do not want to rely on a companies’ choices for future development. You decide, we have to accept and follow. Simply not okay. Please don’t point at Apple at this, which is simply another vendor with their own agenda. You also don’t want us to look at them when there’s a new release of macOS and NI is way behind.

    Native Instruments should simply offer a better alternative for installing (deprecated) software and expansion packs manually, including an offline authorization process. Same goes for activating (deprecated) hardware, which is simply bricked if we have to reset it and your service is down. This doesn’t mean you have to support it for decades to come, but at least provide a downloadable installer with the option to activate it offline.

    Yes I know all mumbo jumbo about piracy, bla bla bla… but it’s not us as paying customers who should experience all the negatives. You as a development team are a stakeholder in this and benefit from keeping up Native Access as a platform, but I think you should also be held accountable for a decent alternative. Especially when iit comes to deprecated products or versions.

    This is all about regaining and maintaining TRUST, a very profitable bottomline.

  • Bruce MacLeod
    Bruce MacLeod Member Posts: 3 Member
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    There is a stable version of Native Access running on my M1 Mac Studio (Ventura 13.6.1). Native Access 1 version 3.5.5 is available for download, but it can be hard to find:

    https://support.native-instruments.com/hc/en-us/articles/360000407909-Native-Access-Legacy-Installers-for-Older-Operating-Systems

    I have found it fast and stable on my rig. And it doesn't auto-update to the newest unstable version 2. My Mac M1 computer is in a music production studio. I have avoided upgrading my Mac OS past Ventura because the music industry tends to lag behind in software compatibility and stability, and I can't tolerate the down-time. In the above post DunedinDragon points to the necessity to hold off on updates when you are in a production environment. I agree. The music software industry tends to be 6-12 months behind the computer OS update curve.

    My biggest gripe with Native Instruments is that I am entirely dependent on it to manage the bulk of my sample library collection. The Native Access, Kontakt 7, and Komplete Kontrol software trio has to be rock solid, and sadly at this point in time it's not. I have cobbled together a working setup of Native Access and Kontakt 7, and for now that will have to do.

  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 1,202 Guru
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    @Bruce MacLeod

    "I have found it fast and stable on my rig. And it doesn't auto-update to the newest unstable version 2. I have avoided upgrading my Mac OS past Ventura because the music industry tends to lag behind in software compatibility and stability, and I can't tolerate the down-time.

    Just know that v1 of Native Access is already handicapped and has been restricted from offering the latest updates for many products. And it will be officially retired at years end.

    Your "downtime" will have it's tolerance tested over and over as we wing toward the end of 2024.

    VP

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 692 Pro
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    +1 to this. Resisting the old version of Native Access will eventually run you out of road. Everybody should update.

  • Bruce MacLeod
    Bruce MacLeod Member Posts: 3 Member
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    @Vocalpoint

    "Just know that v1 of Native Access is already handicapped and has been restricted from offering the latest updates for many products. And it will be officially retired at years end.

    Your "downtime" will have it's tolerance tested over and over as we wing toward the end of 2024."

    I do realize the NA v2 software is broken. My tolerance is constantly being tested by this company. It's a Hobson's choice. I can have a restricted version of Native Access with truncated features or a spinning beachball. For now I'll take the restricted version. Hopefully there will be a stable v2 of Native Access long before the end of the year.

    @BIFF

    "+1 to this. Resisting the old version of Native Access will eventually run you out of road. Everybody should update."

    I assume you mean resisting the NEW version will run me out of road. I get it. I'm not planning of resisting new versions of Native Access. I'm resisting unstable versions. The point of this thread is that we would update if we could. For some of us v2 of Native Access is unstable, and in my case it won't even launch. So I'll wait awhile. When a version that works is released I'll install it immediately. In the meantime, for users that are screwed, there is an imperfect workaround in NA v1.

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 692 Pro
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    I get you; you want to avoid "unstable versions". But I'm on 3.11, and it seems to be working fine; at least on Windows. Haven't had time to try it on my own M1 Mac.

    So maybe you have to wait.

  • Freddie Star
    Freddie Star Member Posts: 24 Member
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    Native Access 3.11.1 - Latest version 2024-05-25

    Still same issues! Sometimes it work sometime it won't work?

    Native Team talk about it were when they added the option of "Subscription"- model that made the Native Access get out of order? Go and figure. 😏

    Perhaps the universe try to tell Native Instruments something about that business model. I have never liked "Subscription"-model when it comes to plugins and programs. Better to pay one time payment or let the customers split the total payment into 4 monthly payments- business-model as same as Arturia offer their customers already.

    Netflix, HBO and Spotify is another story that the subscription business-model makes sense. Plugins and programs don't! What happen now is that the "One time payment"-customers example Komplete-customers suffer because Native Instruments decided to add the option of subscription model.

    That can be risky move because of they don't get this bugs sorted out sooner then later they risk losing the real paying upfront customers that are the majority of their loyal user base. No point buy Komplete, Mashine or other hardwares if you can't install it. You can only install the hardwares and softwares by chance, that you have payed for.

    Do you feel lucky today? No, no luck today? Please try later or tomorrow!… Try tomorrow…No, no luck today either? Please try later or tomorrow? Who wants to invest their money and purchase anything when you don't even know, if or when you can use and get what you actually payed for?

    Bets Regards

    Freddie

  • Butchie
    Butchie Member Posts: 4 Member
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    Same problem. Stuck on Loading Products. If I restart it blows me ****** about the NTK Daemon. This is ridiculous for this to go on this long.

  • clearscreen
    clearscreen Member Posts: 7 Member
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    Got this problem as well. Is there any solution in sight? Uninstalled and reinstalled a couple of times now, but 3.11.1 gets stuck on "loading products"…

  • David N
    David N Member Posts: 8 Member
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    After installing version 3.11.1, NA gets stuck on "loading products".

    Please provide a link to d/l previous versions. The last one that worked for me was version 3.08.

    This is absolutely ridiculous.

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