Native Access Q1 Update

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  • Ojustaboo
    Ojustaboo Member Posts: 138 Helper
    edited February 7

    I use Studio One as my DAW, one thing I really like is under its settings I can specify where say loops or instruments are located

    I can simply say put in a new location for my Sound Sets, use windows to move the Sound Sets directory from the old location to the new, and it just works.


  • D-One
    D-One Moderator Posts: 2,689 mod

    Is that so much different than simply using 'Relocate' in NA2? It does exactly the some thing you described..

  • Ojustaboo
    Ojustaboo Member Posts: 138 Helper
    edited February 7

    The difference is in Studio One forum, there aren’t posts like reffahcs earlier in this thread, partly quoted in next paragraph

    “There seems to be tons of issues around relocating libraries. The relocate all doesn't seem to always work, or at least gives people the impression that it doesn't work. Some libraries end up needing "updates" after the content folder is moved? “

    No loading a separate installer to relocate, just change the location from within Studio One, move the directory’s in one go and that’s it, no having certain ones not relocate or needing updates again. It just works.

    I’ve read so many things about people having problems when using relocate that to be honest, I don’t trust it.

  • LostInFoundation
    LostInFoundation Member Posts: 3,973 Expert
    edited February 7

    I stopped buying them. Surely I won’t stop using what I already paid for

    All of this is so true! In my opinion they are wasting time to put the things THEY want in NA, to then tell us the things NA is made for and are not working correctly will be investigated next quarter, next year or next decade…

    But…as I said…it’s their business and they manage it as they want. Just hoping they are even ready to pay the consequences of their decisions. Reading the forum and the internet in general, I’m not the only one stopping buying from them. But probably they made their calculations and they think putting advertisings in NA will make them regain the purchases they lose from existing customers substituting them with new users. I’m not so sure that losing the trust from users that bought practically ALL their products (even in multiple copies) for someone that maybe will buy just a couple and then move on is worth, but…again…it’s their business. Maybe they prefer constant unaware new casual users not knowing their history than someone that knows with whom he is dealing with. And they also think these new users facing the NI world for the first time and immediately falling into that kind of bad experience isn’t important too…another new user will come to substitute also these very quickly deluded ones.

    Once again it’s a matter of the choice between keeping your customers interested by offering valid and innovative products vs pointing at faster and easier money requesting less efforts (specially planning and creative efforts). The choice was between analyzing the loss in sells and saying “ok, we must work better and give perfectly working products and regain the trust” or “ok, we must find the easiest way to have some more sells”. Prioritizing putting advertising in an installation manager instead of fixing it so that it works perfectly speaks out loud to me about what they chose

    I’m the kind of naive guy that still thinks that working good will make you keep your customers AND attract new ones (interested by the products and introduced by the good advertising your happy existing customers will make of your products). But the industry seems to think differently and point in the other direction.

  • Vic Angelo
    Vic Angelo Member Posts: 103 Advisor

    Please no more in app Ads on the products we own. If it's a free product then it makes sense. But dont be putting ads in our products again, like Kontakt did

  • reffahcs
    reffahcs Member Posts: 708 Pro

    I don't think being the NI town square is a bad idea. It's exactly what other companies have only recently figured out. ie inMusic with their new software center.


    I can't imagine how else you would trying to maintain a large collection of products through the install, uninstall and update process. Could you imagine how much of a cluster it would be to have 300+ entries in Windows App manager that you'd have to deal with. Not to mention you'd still have to some sort of program running to handle the updates.

    I like NA as a concept, it would just be nice if it had more functionality and if they could fix a few things that give it a bad wrap. I'm happy that @Hayo_NI gave us an update, because lots of people in the forum complain about not hearing anything from NI. So at least they seem to making an effort on that front, let's hope that it continues into other aspects of NI.

  • LostInFoundation
    LostInFoundation Member Posts: 3,973 Expert
    edited February 7

    I don’t think any of us is completely against a program to manage our installation duties.

    What we are more concerned about is how this program is made.

    Releasing new versions that are clearly not completed (leave alone perfectly working) of a program that was working good before, to then having to wait years to have it back without issues… seeing things like advertising prioritized over fixing things…saying “ok…it is not complete…but we will remove anyway the previous version”… not giving users the choice of what to install and what not (VST, AAX, Au,…)…not offering an easy way to install previous versions of our programs if needed (and since all the debacles they are having with new updates, it is OFTEN needed…)…having a program like NTK Daemon constantly running on our computer for a task that in the end we need only now and then to install or update our programs…

    These are the things we fail to understand.

    In the end…it’s no news to have Native Access…we have it from many years and no one was complaining about it before. For many reasons: we saw its utility, it was working good, it was focused at its duties (installing and managing our products).

    What we fail to see is the reason of this urge in releasing new incomplete versions and removing the one we have working and not so intrusive.

    It’s so easy: work on the program you want. Complete it. Test it. And once it’s ready….release it

  • Hayo_NI
    Hayo_NI Product Team Posts: 262 mod

    Hey VP,

    The EULA is not new. It's a new part of the flow. You can already view the EULA on our website.

  • Hayo_NI
    Hayo_NI Product Team Posts: 262 mod

    Hey D-One, hear you on a bunch of this stuff.

    As I mentioned in a previous comment somewhere, we are looking at supporting uninstall, but we're working with 5 different types of installer technology at the moment, which is going to become quite a pain to maintain down the line. We're looking to reduce it down to one or two, which will allow us to do a lot more with the installers in a much more sustainable way. This is underway right now, alongside some other stuff that I'll have more to say about early next quarter. We've definitely not deprioritized the core part of our tool, we're simply more focused on the interconnectivity and the initial access journey while we iron out the underlying issues to become more agile.

  • Hayo_NI
    Hayo_NI Product Team Posts: 262 mod

    Hey Jojo, loads of stuff to unpack so I'll try my best here.

    When you're setting up your music production/performance suite through Native Access, you'll need to be online. After a successful download, installation, and activation, if you're not a subscriber, you're good to go. You shouldn't need to be online any longer. If any users are seeing this being the case, then reach out to customer support that this is the issue.

    Regarding the discontinuing of NA1, as mentioned in other comments, we will have alternative methods to access legacy products, which we'll inform users more about as we get closer to the date.

    Automated updates will not happen for your products, but they will happen for Native Access. You should not be affected by automatic NA updates, and that does not trigger product updates as a result. Updates that would deprecate support for an operating system your NA is installed and we no longer support on will not go through. NA as a tool is a live service system that will consistently bring improvements as versions go on.

  • Sunborn
    Sunborn Member Posts: 2,134 Expert
    edited February 7

    Could you imagine how much of a cluster it would be to have 300+ entries in Windows App manager that you'd have to deal with.

    All those entries also exist in Windows App Manager (actually, is called "Programs and Features", at least in Win 10).

    Not to mention you'd still have to some sort of program running to handle the updates.

    Updates can be done easily from within the program, it is still the usual way of doing things for the vast majority of Windows applications.

    Those quotes above were just a correction. It doesn't mean the Native Access is not useful, it is. But it definitely lacks many things. It is not flexible and it does not give options to the advanced user to handle things as he prefers.

    As i mention 2 pages before, this "silent install" and the forced installation of too many irrelevant things (such as extra drivers, plugin formats that we don't use, etc.) its a huge disadvantage (at least for users like me).

    It is very annoying that i can have full management of my computer, even the most hidden Windows options, full management on every other app (i even go manually everywhere and delete all the unnecessary languages, manuals, every possible duplicate, even re-routing things through registry etc etc.), but almost no management on Native Access (unless if i spend time to by pass it, which is doable but very boring to do it all the time).

  • Maciej Repetowski
    Maciej Repetowski Member Posts: 369 Pro

    The installation portal should install, uninstall, activate and relocate software in straightforward and tailored (not installing AAX, if one doesn’t use them, for example) way.

    Everything else it might be doing should be secondary to this.

    @Hayo_NI , if you have to deal with 5 different types of installers, why not to re-write the installers, instead of trying to fit square peg into round hole?

  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 668 Pro

    Actually - once you move your Soundsets in Studio One - simply restart the app and there they are.

    Not even close to the experience in Native Access.

    VP

  • lord-carlos
    lord-carlos Member Posts: 2,017 Expert

    That's what they are trying to do:

    We're looking to reduce it down to one or two,

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