Pitch delay (only visual) with Timecode Vinyl on Technics SL-1210MK2

Martin Menacher

Hi,
i have a question on the topic shown above and hope I can get help here.
I am using the following equipment:
- MacBook Pro M2
- Traktor Pro 3 (Version 3.10.0 71)
- Traktor Kontrol Z2
- 2 Technics 1210 Turntables with Timecode Vinyl (Traktor Scratch Control Vinyl MK2)

Unfortunately, the pitch is visually delayed. When I activate the pitch on the turntables, the change in speed is immediately audible, but visually, in the software, there is a delay by approx. 2 seconds.
So I hear the change in speed immediately, but in the software I can only see it 2 seconds later, which unfortunately disturbs me when I'm DJing.

Another smaller problem is that the pitch is inaccurate. For example, if I switch the pitch on the turntable to +8, the software displays +8.2. Is there a way to improve the accuracy?

I really hope these issues are solvable and I want to thank you in advance for your help.

Best wishes
Martin

dariodelima

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/152356#Comment_152356

This is Standard and there will always be a delay in the visual aspect of the BPM from the turntables to the software when using Timecode Vinyl, it happens also with timecode Cd. i can tell you this is the same in rekordbox and Serato. When using HID mode or internal Mode on a controller or such BPM is instant but with timecode it has always had the delay.

DJ Ground

Hallo Martin :)

The Twelves work with traktor in DVS Mode, so you will have the same delay. There is no HID solution for traktor outside native instrument ecosystem.

The delay between Pitch and BPM numbers (its small) and its the normal behaviour.

Normaly with 1200s, there is more pitch diferences on the end of the pitch, than in the middle. You can calibrate the pitches, but generally its not necessary with small diferences.

Grüsse aus Coburg :D

lord-carlos

To be honest I don't even look at the pitch fader in traktor when I do dvs. I know everyone djs differently, but why is it a huge deal? You can see the pitch on your turntable.

lord-carlos

Yes, that is normal. I think it shows a 2 second rolling average bpm.

I think someone had a way to get real time bpm. Maybe it was @Stevan ?

For your second questions: I would guess the inaccuracy comes from your turntables. If it plays faster Traktor will show it as faster.

Owner

You can change it in the Preferences > Track Decks.

Go to the box with your tempo and change it to BPM.

After that, you should always see the current changes in tempo straight away, without delay.

bildschirmfoto-2024-01-08-um-00-22-35.png

Another smaller problem is that the pitch is inaccurate. For example, if I switch the pitch on the turntable to +8, the software displays +8.2. Is there a way to improve the accuracy?

This is might be related to your pitchfader from your turntables. You will find On YouTube some great tutorials for recalibration.

Martin Menacher

Hi,
thanks for your answers, I really appreciate your help.

Unfortunately, the change to BPM in Preferences → Track Decks doesn't solve the problem.
I saw this in a different post, tried it, but it doesn't work.

I made 3 photos today, to make the problem more clear.
As written before, the pitch is only visually delayed in the software.

I hope this helps and I really hope I can get help here, because as it works now is really not how I would like to DJ. If you need more infos, please let me know.

Best wishes
Martin

Pitch Problem Traktor.pdf

lord-carlos

I doubt you can change that.

Martin Menacher

Hello again,

is there anyone from Native Instruments or elsewhere who can help me with this problem or possibly already has the solution?

Surely I'm not the only one who dj´s with Technics 1210 turntables and a Traktor Z2 with timecode?
Is this a known problem? Or does it perhaps not bother other DJs?

In any case, I find it very annoying when the pitch in the software only visually assumes the picked value after a delay of 2 seconds (for details please see above and my uploaded illustration).
If I want to pitch to an exact value, I always have to wait until the software visually adjusts.
I can't imagine that this doesn't bother other DJs.

What possible solutions are there?
I might even be ready to buy a different turntables, if more modern turntables are better suited for use with timecode.

I have a lot of NI products and am a loyal Traktor user for many years, so I'm hoping to get the support I need.
Since there is no longer a hotline, this is the only way to get support, is this right?

Thanks in advance and best wishes
Martin

dariodelima

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/152356#Comment_152356

This is Standard and there will always be a delay in the visual aspect of the BPM from the turntables to the software when using Timecode Vinyl, it happens also with timecode Cd. i can tell you this is the same in rekordbox and Serato. When using HID mode or internal Mode on a controller or such BPM is instant but with timecode it has always had the delay.

Martin Menacher

Hi,
thanks for your answer, it really helps me.
At least I know now that this is "normal" and that I am not the only one who has this issue.
I am not so experienced in DJing with timecode, from I have played with controller over the last several years and as you described there the pitch is instant.

I would have some another questions concerning this issue.
I am thinking of buying the Rane Twelve MK II Battle Controllers, for a second setup, maybe also together with the Traktor Kontrol Z2 Mixer.
Do you know if the pitch would be instant in this setup?
Or is it better to use a different mixer than the Z2?
And can the Rane controllers be connected via USB to the Z2 Mixer (it has 2 USB inputs)?

Many questions, but I really appreciate the help of the experts here. Thanks a lot!

Best wishes
Martin

DJ Ground

Hallo Martin :)

The Twelves work with traktor in DVS Mode, so you will have the same delay. There is no HID solution for traktor outside native instrument ecosystem.

The delay between Pitch and BPM numbers (its small) and its the normal behaviour.

Normaly with 1200s, there is more pitch diferences on the end of the pitch, than in the middle. You can calibrate the pitches, but generally its not necessary with small diferences.

Grüsse aus Coburg :D

Martin Menacher

Hi DJ Ground,

thank you very much for your help, I really appreciate it.

Best wishes
Martin

lord-carlos

To be honest I don't even look at the pitch fader in traktor when I do dvs. I know everyone djs differently, but why is it a huge deal? You can see the pitch on your turntable.

decat_Tf

I had this too but didn't even realise it till my mate came over to play. He told me the pitch of the technics was reacting slowly. A couple of days before he played at another mate's place, also Traktor timecode but on an old Macbook and there the issue wasn't present.

The technics here is used next to a Rane Twelve which, on the contrary of what DJ Ground says, changes instantly when touching the pitch. Maybe because the Rane is also connected by USB?

As for the Technics my mate suggested deleting the settings tsi file and start from scratch. It was the same setting file I was using since years, transfered from Mac to Mac. He said there could be something wonky going on.

After deleting the file it seems to react a little faster. I do look at numbers in Traktor but not at those.

While loading a track I just check what bpm it has and compare it to what is playing. After years of playing you can easily guess where it needs to be so it will just need some fine tuning before bringing it in.

edit: just double check, the Technics and Rane react instantly when touching the fader doing normal adjustments or fine tuning.

When on the Technics going from 0 straight to 8 it needs a sec orso to react but doesn't seems abnormal to me, hence the speed increase.

When doing normal adjustments, let's say track on Technics or Rane are a 125,25 and just doing a little pressure on the fader to get it to 125,35 orso it changes instantly.

AlexGar

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/29641/pitch-delay-only-visual-with-timecode-vinyl-on-technics-sl-1210mk2

Hi!

I have the same problem than you, and it's not "normal". I've being DJing with Timecode (Traktor Scratch Pro 2) for 10 years and I've never experienced such a problem, when I moved the pitch in my SL-1200 Traktor represented it almost inmediatly (with a MBP 2009).

Now I'm using Traktor 3, in a Windows 11 laptop (further more powerful than the MBP 2009), and I stuck with this problem. When I change the speed in the turntable, it takes over 5 second to Traktor 3 to represent it in the screen (both in the digital pitch and in the BPM counter).

I tried to solve it modifying the latency settings, but it didn't works. So, if someone knows how to avoid this annoying issue, I would be very grateful.

pARty_bOy

I cant remember how it was in traktor 2, but I think it has always been this way, small pitch changes Traktor changes faster, big pitch tempo rides traktor "thinks" your "scratching" so waits longer to change the pitch on-screen, audio is instant.

lord-carlos

I have never seen it any other way. But I'm also relative new to Traktor.

pARty_bOy

i still have traktor 2 on my windows machine Ill test this topic.

edit: since traktor 2 the visual delay is there, the audio is instant and the BPM on-screen, but the Tempo Fader moves later, if you fast ride the pitch, the Tempo wont even move has you can see in this video i did

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/7LXRkuZETbI

software latency comparison in timecode response, with pitch rides, check this video

https://youtu.be/zWQ7Anniofc?si=FMN7Pos6bgIjou4j

in conclusion: I think Traktor Digital Vinyl System is Best in the market, the best vinyl emulation. the very slow scratches sound much better in Traktor than Serato and Virtual DJ, I never tried RB.