Native Access Q1 Update

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  • Uwe303
    Uwe303 Moderator Posts: 2,900 mod

    Like the steinberg software, there you can set another folder for your libraries and the software is doing it, will copy everything over to the new folder and no problem with activation. I installed cubase and some libraries in the wrong place but with this functionality I was able to easily move the stuff to my library drive - so this is how things should be for sure, no two options allowed 🤣🤣.

  • Hayo_NI
    Hayo_NI Product Team Posts: 262 mod
    edited February 8

    Hi VP,

    If there are no products (that are not Applications) that need repair, this feature does not appear. This is for products that are in need of Relocation, as opposed to locating.

    Difference between a relocation and a locating is that Products that do not exist as installed in Native Access but have been installed somewhere need to be authenticated in Native Access, which can be done by triggering Locate (for supported products). When your product has already been activated, but it seems to be missing files/has been moved, then you can repair it through a Relocate.

    I take your point that the nomenclature introduces some confusion. See it more as Re-locate (locate again) as opposed to Relocate (move). We'll look into making this clearer, thanks for the feedback

  • Hayo_NI
    Hayo_NI Product Team Posts: 262 mod

    Just adding, the relocate discussion has been incredibly insightful, so thanks again for that everyone!

  • Sunborn
    Sunborn Member Posts: 2,134 Expert

    Thanks for clarifying this.

    "And point taken that we need to offer more control down the line on what gets installed, but that requires insight into the files present behind the installer, which we don't have yet!"

    No worries, i am very patient. Patience is a virtue. 😊

  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 668 Pro
    edited February 8

    @Hayo_NI

    "I take your point that the nomenclature introduces some confusion. We'll look into making this clearer, thanks for the feedback"

    FWIW: I continue see "Relocate" (button label) being quite pointless when used for this scenario:

    "When your product has already been activated, but it seems to be missing files/has been moved"

    This is a "Repair" - period. The use of the term "Relocate" - especially when "Locate" is already in play just makes this more confusing.

    Labels and functions here that only a programmer could love :)

    VP

  • reffahcs
    reffahcs Member Posts: 708 Pro

    I do agree that having a single location for content greatly simplifies things. But I think there's still a use case for supporting multiple locations, given the size of some libraries and that a lot of users seem to be running older systems. A lot of people don't have a 4TB external drive to put everything in one place.

  • MorrisEd
    MorrisEd Member Posts: 30 Member

    NI first said MIDI templates would be available in Dec 2023; then mid-Q1 24; and now first half 2024. I went in another direction so it doesn’t matter anymore. I doubt I will go back to using the MK3 unless I need to control a NI plug-in, which hopefully is not frequently.

  • Matthew_NI
    Matthew_NI Product Team Posts: 682 mod

    I can only say that I've been consistent in stating the work would begin in Q4, and that we'd aimed to deliver in Q1 to the first half of the year. We're on track for our March beta. In any case, please might we take a keyboard topic over to the Kontrol area of the forum? This isn't the thread.

  • Ojustaboo
    Ojustaboo Member Posts: 138 Helper

    That is always the danger. We ask for news, we ask for details, if they don’t estimate a date, we are not happy, so a business gives a date that they are aiming for, things happen and it’s taking longer than hoped, we then say “hey you said we would have that by now….”

    Or a business releases a product on the date that they originally said, and as the product needs a few more weeks/months to sort out the bugs, we complain saying they shouldn’t have released it in that buggy state.

    In a way they can’t win.

    But, presuming they had a good number of beta testers for the mk3 series, problems should have been noticed before release.

    While I appreciate with all the different hardware that we use, it’s inevitable that there will be some customers where things don’t go smoothly regardless of how much testing has been done, in my opinion the mk3 was released before it was ready.

    Sadly most people don’t tend to make posts or vids saying how much they love something, they tend to only do this when things go wrong, and the mk3 series has some really negative reviews out there and if there is say a good YouTube vid about the series, you can almost guarantee that in the comments will be people slagging both it and NI off. I think the way this has happened has done them a lot of short term damage.

    I bought mine in January knowing the problems people were having, because I needed an 88 weighted keyboard, and I reasoned that hopefully over the year, it will turn out to be the beast we all hoped it would be.

    Initially I thought that NI made the correct decision not including a power supply in the box, thinking that only a few people would actually need them, but it appears, especially with the 88 note, that tons of us need them. I had to wait a day from delivery just to get a power supply from Amazon. A lot of people would be really pissed off having their brand new and expensive keyboard unusable because of no included power supply.

    Thing is, not having a power supply, yes it’s annoying but people will get over it. But if they wait a day or so to get one, then turn it on and it won’t do anything except tell us to update the firmware, then we follow the instructions and it fails, we then look on the internet and see we are not alone, we contact support and they are inundated with sales etc so slower to respond, we have an unusable product in our houses/studios that cost well over £1000 (88 note).

    We then follow instructions to get the driver installed and yes it works. But that whole rigmarole can really really really annoy people, and when they’ve experienced that, and then find out say midi templates aren’t working yet, people understandably blow their top, hence the bad press follows.

    Then, in my case I saw the firmware update to 1.5.7, as my previous update had worked and as device manager showed my S88 was correctly installed, I go to update it and it fails just like the original one failed.

    Sure NI were very helpful, Jeremy posted instructions that fixed it, but add all that together and it’s understandable why people are unhappy. And people are obviously going to wonder “is this sort of thing going to happen every firmware update”

    It’s only because I’ve got a lot of new stuff lately including Collectors edition, a new DAW (Studio One) and a new Arturia Keylab mk2 61 that I’ve been so relaxed about my S88, I’ve been enjoying playing with the rest of my gear hence have been kept busy enough to keep a level head. If my S88 had been my only keyboard it would have been a completely different situation.

    I do really like my S88 though and think it has great potential.

  • LostInFoundation
    LostInFoundation Member Posts: 3,973 Expert
    edited February 9

    @Hayo_NI i have a question

    Let’s say a user is on Windows 8 and he wants to stay there.

    Once NA 2 will be Windows 10 or newer only compatible…and it will auto update itself…and you will remove NA 1… how are you gonna manage this situation?

    At this point, users not wanting to update their OS will need an alternative way to install ALL their products, not only legacy ones (I don’t even know why you used the “legacy” term more than once), not being able to keep a NA version compatible with their system.

    Is NI going back to provide installers and activation for all their products outside of NA again? In this way you will lose what you’re aiming for (being able to have all users “under control” with your central installation/activation system).

    I see where you are coming from: “if all users will have the version we want them to have, we will be able to reduce the number of people that have problems because previous versions are not (or less) maintained”…a little bit what we have now with NA 1 not having some installers and users coming to ask “why can’t I find my product?”. But this is not what is gonna happen…you will just shift those requests to “why NA is not working on my system?”. Which could be even worst…

    This situation seems to me like the Kontakt debacle we have now, with libraries getting updated with latest Kontakt 7 requirement and Jeremy constantly having to provide previous versions of libraries in a thread every time a new library gets updated. Soon that thread will need ALL the libraries’ previous versions to be added… But in NA case you will have the aggravation of having to provide also an alternative way to activate the libraries and programs if users won’t have access to NA

    Wouldn’t it be wiser to leave something available for those users? A NA version not auto updating to a version not compatible with their systems? Why deliberately complicating your own job so much?

    I think something could be learnt from the Kontakt situation we have now… libraries are not auto updating themselves…and users make errors anyway manually updating them…and then come complaining and you have to provide previous versions of all libraries… (at least in the case of NA you’ll have to provide a single one).

    The hope that forcing to use newer OS (or newer Kontakt) will suffice to make users move to those versions is…well…just naive…specially if this requires users to spend money to adequate to your requests. Part of them will remain with what they have, since it’s enough for them (or even more suited for them)…and therefore they don’t see why they should spend more money just because you decided to abandon something…and then they will come and complain

    Imagine what will happen with an auto updating central brain program that serves all these functions and all NI products…Auto update is a bad, bad decision…

  • reffahcs
    reffahcs Member Posts: 708 Pro
    edited February 9

    Speaking of Native Access...

    @Hayo_NI I remembered another bug I've seen happen a few times before so tonight while downloading some new libraries, so I decided to do a test so I could take screenshots to illustrate the issue.

    Basically the issue is that it appears some installations are halted or waiting for the next download to complete before they can finish installing. Some sort of locking/blocking issue going on here.

    In this case Anima Ascent is just under 1GB and Lores is over 70GB. I have a Mac Studio M2 Ultra and I'm using an external NVMe for storage, so shouldn't be any computer limitations. Yes Anima Ascent didn't finish installing until more than 2 hours later when Lores finished downloading. Once it did, it was only a matter of seconds before it installed.

    I can do another test if you think it would be helpful of timing how long it takes to download and install Anima Ascent by itself. But I think it's safe to say that at least some downloads disrupt the installation process of other libraries.

    This has happened to me a few times before, I just picked two of the most extreme libraries to screen shot as an example.

  • Paul B
    Paul B Member Posts: 49 Helper

    InstallerBuilder for iZotope software that is and will be supported on Native Access (Ozone, iZotope Elements Suite products)

    @Hayo_NI This implies that not all iZotope products will be managed through Native Access.

    Will it ever be the case that iZotope and Plugin Alliance products are managed through Native Access? This would be vastly preferable.

    No installation manager is perfect, but Native Access is one of the best out of several that I have. And the iZotope and Plugin Alliance ones are easily the worst. I would love to get rid of them.

    I'm not looking for a timeline, but would like to know if this is being considered.

  • MorrisEd
    MorrisEd Member Posts: 30 Member
    edited February 10
  • zassimo
    zassimo Member Posts: 14 Member
    Hi! Just want to mention that my Komplete Kontrol M32 is stuck in MIDI Mode after updating Mac to Sonoma 14.3.1 last night. The device also isn't being recognized by the KKM Updater.

    Guessing an update might be needed after this?
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