Kontrol S61 MK3 Firmware Update Issue

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greylight
greylight Member Posts: 6 Member
edited November 2023 in Komplete Kontrol

I would like some advice on how to go about updating the firmware for the S61 MK3. About two weeks ago I received my S61 and attempted to update the firmware. Everything went fine until an image like this popped up. Not my image but it was the exact same, just a different installed firmware version I do believe.

I did not know how to power cycle so I clicked retry and closed the updater and retried again to only get the same messaging. Eventually I googled how to power cycle and did that. Then I hit retry and got this exact message. This is from my PC.

At this point I found the trouble shooting guide which at the bottom stated if you see this the product is basically bricked. So, I returned it to the place of purchase and have a new one that will be sent to me tomorrow.

How do I make sure this does not happen again? What steps do I need to take to install this without issue?

Here is my current plan:

  1. Use external power supply this time.
  2. Use a USB C hub to connect to computer this time.

In this process when is it safe to quit the updater? When is it safe to retry?

Here is my system info:

Windows 10 Pro 22H2 Version (Edit - I am on the latest version of Windows and did see the DFU Entry)

i9-12900k

64 GB 3600 DDR4

980 PRO NVMe M.2 SSDs direct into motherboard

Motherboard: ASUS Prime Z690-P D4 (Wi-Fi)

Graphics Card: GeForce RTX 3060 Ti 8GB

1000W Power Supply

I hope someone here can give guidance or maybe the firmware updater has been updated since and this will not be an issue. I really want this to work...really lost at this point.

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  • greylight
    greylight Member Posts: 6 Member
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    So my update finally worked!

    I think the issue is with my motherboard and the USB C port. I had to get a 65 watt power supply and a cable that was capable of 65 watts. Then I had a USB C to USB 3 dongle plugged into a 3.0 port.

    Once I did all that the update ran and did not immediately fail. The update for whatever reason took about 10 minutes and then a moment for the reboot and all is well now.

    This is what I used incase anyone runs into the same issue.

    Thank you to everyone that assisted and stuck around for my song and dance!

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Answers

  • mykejb
    mykejb Moderator Posts: 1,282 mod
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    There are problem with updating the firmware on S88, not sure if it's same for the S61.

    S88 MK3 Windows Users - Read this before you try the initial FW Update!!! — Community (native-instruments.com)

    -- Mike

  • greylight
    greylight Member Posts: 6 Member
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    It is crazy the amount of research I have done this week to try and figure this out. I did see another post from an NI user about it being only an issue with S88 but found more people like me that have the same issue on S61.

    I want this to work and not go through this again. If it fails and bricks again I will just get my money back and move onto another company. Sucks though because I utilize Komplete Ultimate and this seems to be the perfect controller for that especially if they get Cubase DAW integration fully functional.

    I guess I will have to try again with this new unit tomorrow and hope for the best but I am thinking I will get the same result. Not sure an external power supply and hub will save the day.

  • PoorFellow
    PoorFellow Moderator Posts: 3,365 mod
    edited November 2023
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    Thank you very much for providing such detailed system information. Alas I do not have enough experience with as new motherboard technology such as yours. So I will have to leave it to others (yourself or someone off-line that you know) to evaluate if anything needs to be updated !

    Your 'current plan' appear to be a good one (Use an external power supply this time and Use an USB C hub to connect to the computer this time

    Only remember that the USB-C hub ought to be a self-powered one.

    Also I think it advice-able that you download and use the latest hardware interface agent as well as the latest version of firmware update software. In other words Native Instruments are working so hard to fix things at the moment that they could have updated things again even if you just downloaded things the other day !

    At the moment , to me at least , a lot of it with respect to peoples problems appear to be almost 'hit-and-miss' because depending on the mix of technologies involved.

    But I do think that you will have a fair shot at being successful the second time around. But honestly, even if you brick another unit, I do not think that you will do I am just saying, then stick to getting your unit fixed to work. If you got Komplete Ultimate then you do not need me to tell you what an amazing hardware software-combo that you will have once that N.I. gets it all polished sufficiently I don't know if everything Cubase is fixed (?) but if you have any problems with it then I think that N.I. will deliver on that given time to fix an eventual problem (use support if you have to !). Incidentally the upgrades are on offer again at the moment !

    It goes without saying that it all ought to have been a more smooth ride for you and it's hard having problems the like of yours with an investment like this , but think of it from the bright side ! At least you did not have any problem getting N.I. to swap your bricked unit so even if it is/has been a rough ride then in the end N.I. have you covered !

    Best wishes for the second time around getting your unit to behave and properly setup !

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 651 Pro
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    My USB-C hub (the one I used for my MK3's firmware update and the one my MK3 is still plugged into) is not a powered hub, but I agree with your advice. I think that a powered hub "SHOULD" provide steady and continuous power during the firmware update, and I may try to source one before the next firmware update comes out.

  • greylight
    greylight Member Posts: 6 Member
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    Thank you so much and I did notice there is a newer version of the firmware updater now so will definitely use that.

    My USB C hub is plugged into the USB C port on my computer and delivers power it seems by that. Do you mean to say I need a power supply plugged into my port?

  • PoorFellow
    PoorFellow Moderator Posts: 3,365 mod
    edited November 2023
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    A self-powered USB-C hub means that the hub got it's own power supply attached (so that the power that the hub supplies to other units comes from the hub's power supply as opposed to if from the computer). But as BIF reported/mentioned then though advice-able then it might not be necessary that the USB-C hub is self powered as long as you are using one that is , what is necessary is that you also attach a suitable USB-C power adapter to the keyboard's power inlet using a cable that supports USB-C power delivery. And that you make sure that cables used to connect to the computer supports data transfer (maybe best if cable to computer supports both data and power , I dunno). Also you ought not have other USB things connected to the computer while attempting to update firmware , and especially not to the USB-C hub.

    Also reports on the time taken for updating have varied a lot from maybe 10-15 minutes to 10 hours (people may have used a very slow USB port) , but it is important that you let firmware update run til it's end until you either get a finished or an error.

    Oh ! , yes , I almost forgot , you might want to kill all Windows power management on the computer for the duration of the firmware update , especially for the USB-C port so that the computer can not go into any power savings mode !

  • reffahcs
    reffahcs Member Posts: 848 Guru
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    I believe out of the box the S series has issues with Windows (before the keyboard is updated). Before I discovered the USB-C issue I had tried to update my S61 on Windows as well and ran into the driver issue that has been talked about in other thread.

    @greylight Connect your keyboard to your PC and power it on. Open up Device Manager in Windows and please let us know if you see a device that says something with S61 DFU in it with a yellow triangle with a ! inside of it.

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 651 Pro
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    +1 on the idea of disabling power management during the firmware update. My DAW only blanks the screen after a period of not using it. No sleeping, no shutting down.

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 651 Pro
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    "I believe out of the box the S series has issues with Windows (before the keyboard is updated)."

    It may...but mine updated fine on Windows 11. So there may be edge cases to that statement. I didn't do a rain dance before updating my firmware either, but that could be another edge case... ⛈️

  • reffahcs
    reffahcs Member Posts: 848 Guru
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    Ahh... I was on Windows 10... wonder if that made a difference. Once updated on my Mac though it's fine on Windows.

  • greylight
    greylight Member Posts: 6 Member
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    No matter what I plug in it still states low power supply. I tried 3 different charges all within spec and no go. I also tried using a higher power one from a power strip and still low power. I eventually plugged it into my hub that is not self powered and the hub into the C port and that powered it.

    Really afraid as I am to the point where it states get the latest update.

  • greylight
    greylight Member Posts: 6 Member
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    This looks good I think

    And I see this running

    Maybe I just give it a shot but if it fails it is not self powered so will not be able to switch to any other usb port.

  • PoorFellow
    PoorFellow Moderator Posts: 3,365 mod
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    Looks good , but you really ought to get the keyboard to accept a power supply on the power inlet. Make sure that the cable used supports Power Delivery ! The keyboard might need additional power when updating the firmware. Your present setup might be able to deliver the power , I mean I don't know, but better safe than sorry and additional power ought not hurt !

  • greylight
    greylight Member Posts: 6 Member
    Answer ✓
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    So my update finally worked!

    I think the issue is with my motherboard and the USB C port. I had to get a 65 watt power supply and a cable that was capable of 65 watts. Then I had a USB C to USB 3 dongle plugged into a 3.0 port.

    Once I did all that the update ran and did not immediately fail. The update for whatever reason took about 10 minutes and then a moment for the reboot and all is well now.

    This is what I used incase anyone runs into the same issue.

    Thank you to everyone that assisted and stuck around for my song and dance!

  • reffahcs
    reffahcs Member Posts: 848 Guru
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    Glad you got things sorted! I've ran into similar painful USB-C issues with the Quest 2 and the HP Reverb G2 VR headsets.

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