Waiting for Maschine MK4, Maschine Studio MK2, or Komplete Kontrol MK3

123578

Comments

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,119 Guru

    That would be good until they decide to stop supporting one of the modular devices. Then it would be terrifying to have to figure out how to keep your stuff working the next time you upgrade Komplete.

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 3,145 Expert

    Well, Maschine MK1 still works with current Komplete, I guess. I do not see any reason it would not.

    X1/F1/Z1 work with Traktor for ages. And D2 or S5 that have been discontinues as well.

    But even if it is not supported by newer versions, one may use it with older ones... One cannot expect support for HW to go forever. Sooner or later it ends...

  • ShelLuser
    ShelLuser Member Posts: 270 Pro

    @BIF

    You CAN'T "get the most out of your setup", because Native makes new things INCOMPATIBLE with your setup if you have their old software and devices.

    Example 1: Kore2 was stopped. I still have the hardware (2 of them, actually), but it doesn't DO ANYTHING with the current versions of Kontakt or any of the other Komplete apps.

    It's not exactly new for any company to eventually stop supporting older stuff, including hardware. Ableton doesn't really support their first line of Push controllers anymore for example, Reason Studios has long abandoned their Balance audio interface and yes: NI stopped with Kore.

    However, you're now leaving out the fact that NI has released several Kontakt instruments that are a perfect substitute for previous Kore instruments. ... not to mention that back then the NKS standard wasn't really a thing, hardly as big of an issue as it is now.

    Example 2: Guitar Rig 6 does NOT work with the old Rig Controller.

    Can't really comment on this because I don't use this line of hardware, but if that critter sends out MIDI signals then I'm convinced that you can make this with with any kind of DAW that supports MIDI mapping.

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,119 Guru

    Hi, Shelluser:

    Those were TWO EXAMPLES. If I give you ten examples, will you refute me every time? Is it your role to defend Ative Instruments every time somebody gives an example to help explain their complaint?

    They told us Kore wasn't compatible. It was definitely NOT obsolete when they canceled it. They told us Rig Kontrol wasn't compatible. It only became obsolete when GR6 was made to not work with it. And they won't at least open the interfaces to allow people to develop such solutions for either of those controllers.

    If it's really and truly obsolete technology (in both or either case) then what would be the harm of providing an open interface for both of those? But no. We see NOTHING.

    Also, you basically told me the same thing for both devices, but you gave me OPPOSITE REASONING for them. Kore is gone, live with it. Rig should work, I'm sure you can MAKE it work. Wait, what?

    I'm sorry, but you can't have it both ways. Either we can make neither of them work because the interfaces are still closed, or we can make both of them work because ...what, magic is green?

    Anyhow, my EXAMPLES still stand. Ative Instruments cancels stuff. The only way you know if something is NOT canceled is the day a new version comes out. Hence Maschine+, KK MK2, Komplete 14. But if they go 2-3 years without a new one, then the customer MUST assume that they're going to discontinue that thing, or the most valuable part of that thing.

    For that reason, I would not be keen on modular versions of Maschine or whatever.

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 5,586 mod
    edited June 2023

    NI has released several Kontakt instruments that are a perfect substitute for previous Kore instruments

    Hardly! Kore 2 was a masterpiece and nothing NI have released since can replace it entirely. Komplete Kontrol, Maschine and NKS still don't come close unfortunately, neither do any Kontakt instruments. I wish they did.

  • Toltemic
    Toltemic Member Posts: 69 Helper

    I think the Maschine mk3 is as good as it is- just needs more software focus, preferably with software features to enhance hardware interfacing rather than trying to make DAW out of Maschine 2. The only thing I would see them do is a minor hardware revision that incorporates MPE pads. Traktor on the other hand...

    Personally I think the combination of the Jam and Komplete keyboards would allow it to c(K)ompete against an interface that's feature rich on midi keyboards whilst still having already mapped controls for kk and Maschine. Also bring Arp and scales natively to the hardware please.

    Terrible photoshop idea below on an s49, bigger the keyboard the more parts of the jam exist, bigger button matrix, more touch faders

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 5,586 mod
    edited June 2023

    Maschine is a beat oriented device that’s pretty limited for use with instruments due to lack of support for even channel aftertouch, let alone poly aftertouch, MPE or Midi 2. As I said earlier I hope NI are developing a new range of keyboards and maybe also a new Maschine version that support more modern expression standards. It would be great if this also included things like the true patch morphing that Kore 2 offered and nothing can yet replace, as well as proper support for FX and multis.

  • Esoterra
    Esoterra Member Posts: 2 Newcomer

    Glad I found this thread. I almost pulled the trigger on a a bunch of NI hardware and software. I finally got out of a Mexican prison after 40 years. My last set up was a Korg M1 and an Alesis MMT-8…..wow….technology and hardware have come such a long ways. I figured I’d send it headfirst, but getting used gear seems the smart play.

  • nightjar
    nightjar Member Posts: 1,325 Guru
    edited August 2023

    Here's another rough cut:

    16 continuous knobs instead of 8... screen right above is one long horizontal instead of current 2 small screens. In this example, it is displaying 2 rows of macros from Massive X... they show labeling and level of these 16 parameters to be manipulated with the actual knobs below.

    The "4D-Push controller" on current Mk2 has been replaced with an "Apple laptop quality" trackpad with Muti-touch gestures for screen navigation and selection. Can also be navigation and selection for desktop screen GUI. Can also be used to record x/y modulation.

  • Percivale
    Percivale Member Posts: 235 Pro

    For MK4, we should go landscape rather than square. It's almost all there, essentially the device just needs another row of sixteen step buttons like the Elektron so we can parameter lock stuff. Of course, there is a whole bunch of ideas how to make the next iteration of Maschine.

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,119 Guru


    Saw that in your other thread. No thanks, unless I can have other options to display. I want bigger on-device monitors first and foremost. Or the ability to use a smartphone or tablet to provide device-screen services.

  • nightjar
    nightjar Member Posts: 1,325 Guru

    "....or tablet to provide device-screen services."

    There ya go! 100%

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,119 Guru
    edited August 2023

    Okay, it's time for a new idea. We're just talking about pictures of rotaries and screen dimensions, and I think the MK4 should be a lot more than just an incremental nudge.

    How about a Komplete Keyboard with TWO MANUALS of keys, with keyswitch keys on the left side of each manual. Add to that the underpinnings built into Komplete Control to drive it like you have one instrument or two separate instruments. With "keyboard split", you could have up to 4 sounds simultaneously. Bigger models could offer more features.

    Think Komplete Control meets Hammond meets MIDI 2.0 meets 2024. And for good measure, add some specialized switches or x/y pads to drive the new Leslie speaker simulation or any other effect, just like on an old-school Hammond. Allowing for gestures while playing would possibly add a new dimension for live playing.

    Oh, and since this would be a big instrument (thicker, deeper, and maybe even wider), it should come with bigger screens (or one huge screen twice the size of all the screens on the prior version) and the same full-color LED lights for both manuals of keys.

  • LostInFoundation
    LostInFoundation Member Posts: 5,257 Expert
    edited August 2023

    …and it would cost twice (or more…) the price of the prior version 😂😂😂

    Jokes apart…I agree with your vision. Not talking about the contents you ask for, but exactly about the price.

    In my opinion, instead of replacing the existing hardwares, they should think about making “deluxe” versions. The actual line up could be their “entry level” for the (very important) hobbyists market, while an improved, enriched, enlarged line up would be something professional musicians could be interested to. Double keyboard (as per your suggestion), MPE, larger screens,… All of this comes at a cost, but not replacing what they already got would allow them to sell devices to the people with a budget but also to the professionals who knows that even if they spend 2k or 3k, them using it for their job would allow to regain the price.

    This is the only way to hope that NI will put ALL the things we dream of into a single device. As I said, features comes at a price, and today’s market is made of users like us saying “I want this and that” but then not buying things because “hey, it’s too pricey”.

    And NI seems more like a company who thinks “I want to put out this device and having it be in every house”, not “I want to put out a very complete device and if only some musician will buy it, I will gain my money anyway because they paid a good price for it”

    It’s nowadays economy’s dilemma of “better selling a lot of unities at a lower price than few unities at a higher price”

    Until we’ll continue to want to spend 400-500 bucks because “it’s an hobby…and in every case in 2 years I want to buy something new”, those very complete devices will not be the focus of companies. Technology has become too fast in modern days…in 2-3 years some very appealing new things will arise and therefore buying something very expensive because we know for the next 10-15 years we will be set up is not the case anymore.


    What I would prefer to see is companies expanding the possibilities of the products they have and adding all the features that can be added in the following years (even by paying for them, in order to keep the company having a cash revenue). There are so many things that could be added on the software side of things. Think just about what Mr Kymeia is asking from a long time: we have S series keyboards allowing for aftertouch…and still Maschine don’t recognize it… Or what other companies are doing: Akai released a very valid device with the Force, and through the years they made it even better adding to it an arranger mode, instruments, fxs, workflow improvements… And they did it for free, just knowing that making it a better device, more units would be sold. Ableton thought its standalone device to be expandable (they nailed it? Maybe not…but at least they thought about it…)

    Therefore…a better thought device, that will be improved through the years to reach its real full potential (maybe something new that can not be implemented will come out…but if on 20 new features we can have 15 of them on the device we already own we would miss the 5 remaining less). And not creating doubles just because “hey…but this new device has blue keys…I need it!”. Maybe it would be better also for our (not) beloved planet earth… And to cure our consumerism and GAS syndrome

  • nightjar
    nightjar Member Posts: 1,325 Guru

    Well.. as we get one week closer to a reveal of the next-generation NI keyboard controllers, I am more sure that the best path going forward is for NI to totally abandon the concept of browsing for presets by means of the on-device display. There is simply no way to provide a truly elegant selection and results presentation within the practical size restrictions of this space.

    Let these next-generation controllers best serve their fundamental purpose: Translating motor skills into expressive performance data. Remote control of DAW functions that are pertinent to performance capture is the second most vital purpose of these devices.

    Doing these two thing elegantly is what matters most. They need to be "real-time" capable and allow the performer to stay in friction-free creative flow.

    The task of preset browsing is NOT a "real-time" activity and far better accomplished on the large screen available on the attached computer rig. Trying to do this task on the keyboard display forces a huge compromise to the entire Komplete Kontrol environment and overall user experience.

    Give it up.

Back To Top