STEM format for self assemble

UncleAndyV
UncleAndyV Member Posts: 6 Member
edited October 22 in Tech Talks

Hi, All!

I try assemble stem file from wav on linux. I encode wav to m4a (I try use aac and alac). And I assemble it to one mp4 file. Track 0 - mix, track 1 - drums, track 2 - bass, track 3 - instruments, track 4 - vocal. It is looks like original stem file from Stem Creator. But when I import it to collection, it not detected like STEM file. It is detected only like simple track. :(((

What I doing wrong?

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Comments

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 3,051 Expert

    I do not know, maybe some additional info?

    Could you, please, if you succeede with aac or alac try also flac. It would interest me if STEM can work using flac. Alac does not work on Win and aac is too loosy (at least from STEM Creator).

  • UncleAndyV
    UncleAndyV Member Posts: 6 Member

    I see tags in original STEM file (from Stem Converter). I try remove it from this file and file correctly imported to Traktor Pro as STEM. Then I think problem not in metadata.

    I try using flac as source of audio, but I can not implement flac to m4a without recoding. If I can create correct STEM file with AAC codec, I can use high bitrate for recoding for best quality. But I can not while. :(

  • UncleAndyV
    UncleAndyV Member Posts: 6 Member

    I see this JSON in original STEM file (in raw mode view):

    `stem{"mastering_dsp": {"compressor": {"ratio": 3, "output_gain": 2.160000085830689, "enabled": true, "threshold": 0, "attack": 0.003000000026077032, "input_gain": -4.800000190734863, "release": 0.300000011920929, "hp_cutoff": 300, "dry_wet": 50}, "limiter": {"release": 0.05000000074505806, "threshold": 0, "ceiling": -0.3499999940395355, "enabled": true}}, "version": 1, "stems": [{"color": "#fd4a4a", "name": "Drums"}, {"color": "#ffff00", "name": "Bass"}, {"color": "#00e8e8", "name": "Synths"}, {"color": "#ad65ff", "name": "Vox"}]}`

    How I can add this data to my STEM file?

  • UncleAndyV
    UncleAndyV Member Posts: 6 Member

    I do IT!!! :)

    In attache - my first worked version perl script (use external utils for do anything) for convert wav files to STEM. I use 512k bitrate for fast quality, but I research posibilites for lossless formats.


    wavs2stem.zip


  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 3,051 Expert

    You are right, it looks like flac cannot be used in mp4 container.

    But good job. Would it work under Win? Few guys who are on Win and so cannot use STEMs with ALAC coding would be happy with anything better audio quality than what goes out of Stem Converter....

  • UncleAndyV
    UncleAndyV Member Posts: 6 Member
    edited February 2023

    Thanks!

    I try do it for Windows. But not in near time. I recode this from Perl to Golang.

    And I use project https://github.com/axeldelafosse/stemgen.git like reference. May by you can using this project for create stems under Windows. It using Python.

  • Wades
    Wades Member Posts: 25 Member

    Hello guys, thank you @Kubrak for inviting me to this thread.

    @UncleAndyV thanks for sharing your experience, I also tried to create my own .stem.mp4 by using ffmpeg instead of Stem Creator cause Stem Creator creates only bad audio quality .stem.mp4 file which is annoying and makes stem useless.

    The result? Traktor doesn't want to analyze the file I created with ffmpeg. I also tried to used .aac file in Stem creator but same problem.

    FYI: I'm on windows

    Would you have any ideas to resolve it please? I'm fying for a solution, I also post the problem on the forum in different topics which talk about it but noone seems to have a solution.

    Stems concept has been relased in 2015 and is still not usable for windows users, this doesn't make any sense from NI..

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 3,051 Expert

    @Wades

    I might try to make a STEM creator for Windows. I am computer programmer and sort of occasional DJ and music producer. So, good combination of skills and needs. But the only problem is the time.

    I do not promise anything, one day I might jump in. It should not be much work. Shame NI has not improved at least the bitrate....

  • Mutis
    Mutis Member Posts: 472 Pro
    edited February 2023

    Maybe this will be helpful. I know the developer and he’s very accessible (also has discord community) so maybe can implement new ideas and so. I told him about implement NI stem support so…


    https://www.stagecraftsoftware.com/products/simplestems


  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 3,051 Expert

    The thing is not to create stem files from single file, but to make NI STEM file (in decent audio quality) from stem files exported from DAW usable in Traktor on Win.

  • Michael Niotakis
    Michael Niotakis Member Posts: 54 Helper

    I don't think this project using mp4box has been raised yet.

    https://github.com/faroit/stempeg


    https://github.com/faroit/stempeg/issues/31 discussed some challenges earlier in the project.

    Hope that helps

  • Mutis
    Mutis Member Posts: 472 Pro
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/53816#Comment_53816

    I know and I advised the dev in that direction. Meanwhile RipX/DeepAudio maybe let add own audio inside their “DAW” and it has NI stem file format export.

  • Wades
    Wades Member Posts: 25 Member

    Hi guys, sorry for the very late reply!

    @Mutis I tried with RipX and I had a lot of hopes when I saw this software appering on many different forums but unfortunately it doesn't allow you to bring your own stems to make one stem.mp4 file, I mean: everytime you import an audio file it will attempt to split it into differents stems.

    @Kubrak I do not know if your comment is still up to date but it would be wonderful to develop it, even if it's absolutely abnormal that customers have to work for their own products to work..

    Let me know if you want to and we could go on a specific discord salon to talk about it, I also can help you by testing everything (I'm also working in informatic as a tester haha)

    Best regards guys!

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 3,051 Expert

    @Wades I will look at it as soon as I will complete my commercial projects. Few more months....

    I haven't tried STEMs yet, but I occasionally DJ and also produce "music". So, it might be interesting to have solution also for me.

    Hard to say why NI does not update it. It should be easy for them...

    My guess is this is niche for them, or they hope ALAC will work soon on Win. And also that they work on live STEMs separation within Traktor.

    Still, I do not understand, why NI have not integrated STEM creation into Maschine SW. It would be natural thing to do. Many Traktor users are also music producers....

  • axeldelafosse
    axeldelafosse Member Posts: 28 Helper

    >they hope ALAC will work soon on Win


    Looks like ALAC is supported since Windows 10. I think it's a bug in Traktor actually.

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