Kontakt 7, after VST3 updates, stops making sounds after switching patches, latency, etc

Milkman · 2022-11-07T00:14:16+00:00

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Im using Kontakt 7, and have just upgraded everything during a K14 update. My whole environment is up to date as of 11/6.

Ive just noticed(inside cubase 12 with K7 as a plugin):

suddenly Kontakt instruments no longer produce sound after switching patches. When I first load the instrument, it produces sound on the first patch. Switching to any other patch leads to no sound. The sound comes back when I delete and re-create the instrument. When keys are pressed, I can see CPU usage but I hear no sound. MIDI and audio routing is all tested good. Cubase 12 config is verified.
There is suddenly 100+ms of delay on every key press on these Kontakt instruments, as if my buffer was up at 512 or more. This delay is not present in any other instrument, plugin, or synth that I use - its only K7. When I reduce my system buffer to 128 from 256, or increase from 256 to 512, the delay reduces and increases as expected, but always has an additional 100ms of delay. I have restarted my DAW (cubase 12), reloaded projects, rebooted the system, verified engine configs, and the issue is the same.
everything loaded via Maschine or Komplete Kontrol is fine - no silence, no problems loading patches, no latency. Inside C12 and in standalone.
In standalone mode... Kontakt 7 has no delay or problem loading patches. Its all in plugin mode.

I can reproduce this easily. Creating an empty C12 project(with or without template) has no effect. Cubase has not been updated in months, and the last update this system had was the recent VST3 support update pushed from NI. Anyone else seeing this?

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Milkman

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/39862#Comment_39862

On, medium guard. (Steinberg default)

Welp. I should have done this before the first post, but it slipped my mind. I turned ASIO Guard completely off, and the problem... seems to have vanished. No more 100ms latency on top of regular latency, no more silent patches when I click "next patch".

In fact I had 'Guard' set at Steinberg's defaults since I built this new machine 2 months ago, wanting to go "by the book" as I broke in a new environment, and now that Guard is off my new system not only sees reduced latency, but I also see reduced CPU across all projects. Guard seems to be the problem... (again).

This environment was all working fine 2 weeks ago. The next thing that happened was I updated to K14, and then NI pushed out the VST3 update last week. Right after the VST3 update the issue began. Then, Steinberg patched C12 to 12.0.50 just a few days ago.

Something to do with Guard broke during one of these recent patches.

Milkman

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/40241#Comment_40241

Steinberg's official advice (and the default setting for Cubase) is ASIO Guard enabled, medium settings.

NI is now officially recommending we NOT enable Guard in Cubase when using NI products? I mean I've dodged a bullet here with a new workstation, but others may not be as lucky. If I was still using the machine I just migrated away from, I would still *need* Guard to reduce audio glitching that unavoidably happens on that platform.

You are saying that, even though the recent NI VST3 update is what triggered the Guard issue in a few K7 instruments, I should reach out to Steinberg? They are literally the last company on earth, aside from Comcast or Amazon, that I want to try to get customer support from. Thanks.

I mean I'm good. I guess others will have to cross this bridge when and if they get to it.

All comments

Its_Leonidas

I'm having this same issue, but with K7 in FL Studio.

Milkman

Ive continued to test. Most K7 instruments have the identical issue listed above, but Kinetic Toys does not. Kinetic Metal has the issue, but Toys advances to the next patch without losing sound, and without 100ms latency on notes.

Since my post, I have:

-wiped C12 Pro's profile and config, and ran on a blank one with a blank project - identical issues.

-reinstalled focusrite scarlett 8i6 gen3 drivers, verified - identical.

-patched C12 using their 12.0.50 maintenance update - identical.

-tried different interface and project sample rates 44/48/88/96 - identical.

Anyone at NI seeing anything else like this? Should I remove and reinstall K7? The only thing I have not yet done is to start removing / reinstalling components...

Milkman

This continues to be a serious issue, and nothing I've done has had any effect. I guess I'll have to open a support ticket soon.

Jeremy_NI

Hey @Milkman have you tried disabling ASIO Guard?

https://steinberg.help/cubase_pro/v11/en/cubase_nuendo/topics/optimizing/optimizing_asio_guard_c.html

Apart from that, if you press the keys on the virtual keyboard inside the Kontakt's window, do you also get that latency?

What instruments or libraries are affected and what are not affected? Are these located at the same place on your computer?

Milkman

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/39502#Comment_39502

Yes - I also get latency when I click the virtual keyboard inside K7.

The only library NOT affected so far is Kinetic Toys. (Im a K14 Ult owner)

Milkman

Sorry - forgot to answer the last part of your question and couldnt edit my comment. Everything is installed on local SSDs. C: drive contains main applications, E: contains all library content.

Jeremy_NI

What avbout ASIO Guard settings?

Milkman

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/39862#Comment_39862

On, medium guard. (Steinberg default)

Something to do with Guard broke during one of these recent patches.

Milkman

For me, with a brand new 24 core machine that suffers no multi threading or hyperthreading issues, I'm able to disable ASIO Guard with positive results, but not everyone will be able to just turn that off without issue, especially those with platforms that experience the hyperthreading / ASIO overload issue still present in Cubase.

I know this isn't NI's technology but the problem I had occurred just after the K14 + VST3 updates, and nothing else had changed. Hopefully NI has some insight into what caused this, and/or can work with our good friends over at... Steinberg to figure out what broke. Thanks.

Jeremy_NI

@Milkman We usually recommend not using the ASIO guard as a troubleshooting step as it fixes similar issues for most users. Of course your comments will be forwarded to the team but it might be good to contact Steinberg too on this issue.

Milkman

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/40241#Comment_40241

Steinberg's official advice (and the default setting for Cubase) is ASIO Guard enabled, medium settings.

I mean I'm good. I guess others will have to cross this bridge when and if they get to it.

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