KK Software vs. Action Strings 2

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phillip2637
phillip2637 Member Posts: 24 Member
in Komplete Kontrol

I have been noticing very slow response times with some NI libraries and I seem to have isolated it to Komplete Kontrol software. I'm using the latest version of Reaper as a DAW on my Mac and find I'm waiting a long time for some actions to finish. Action Strings 2 is an extreme example of the problem.

Here are some test results. Note that there is not only a notable difference between the two libraries using KK, but a massive speedup when KK is not used. I'd like to use KK as my wrapper because of my NI keyboard, but really…! Suggestions?

New project

Load Komplete Kontrol

Load Noire, Ambient Felt - 5 seconds

Save - 8 seconds

New project

Load Komplete Kontrol

Load Action Strings 2, A Pirate Life - 10 seconds

Save - 1 minute

New project

Load Kontakt 8

Load Action Strings 2, A Pirate Life - 10 seconds

Save - sub-second


This is a Mac mini, 3.2 GHz 6-core i7, 32GB.

Best Answers

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,941 admin
    Answer ✓

    I've contacted you by email regarding this issue.

  • phillip2637
    phillip2637 Member Posts: 24 Member
    Answer ✓

    I have just tried three tests with the Kontakt update, where I expected all or most of them to reproduce the problem. They did not! Save and close times were quite reasonable.

    If I do get a repeat, I'll get back in touch about it, but for now it looks like a fix.

    Thanks for your help!

Answers

  • DunedinDragon
    DunedinDragon Member Posts: 1,114 Guru

    This may be related to some adjustments being made right now in Native Access to overcome some inefficiencies in how libraries get loaded. I know in my KK the first library I load from Action Strings takes quite a while to load. After that subsequent libraries are quite fast. But that's on Windows.

  • phillip2637
    phillip2637 Member Posts: 24 Member

    For me, the load times are fairly consistent. The saves are terrible. Sometimes, closing a FX window also gives me a minute-length delay/hang.

    The one similarity with what you're getting is that it's not 100% here. There are times when saves and such just work…but not enough of them! :) It might be related to first time use; I haven't figured out a pattern like that.

  • ShelLuser
    ShelLuser Member Posts: 270 Pro

    I can't help wonder: why even rely on Native Kontrol if you don't use the keyboard and already know what you want to go for?

  • phillip2637
    phillip2637 Member Posts: 24 Member
    edited February 8
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/209989#Comment_209989

    Reasonable, except I would like to use my keyboard. (S49 mk2)

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,941 admin
    edited February 11

    Do Kontakt, Komplete Kontrol and Reaper all have full disk access? How to Enable Full Disk Access on macOS

    Could you also try the following?

    Komplete Kontrol – as per all plugins are set to “run as” =  “automatic” – default setting in Reaper. However, before loading Komplete Kontrol as a track FX, if you set "run as" either a dedicated process or separate process, Komplete Kontrol / Kontakt 7 instruments seem stable.

    image001.png

     

    You can find more information about these modes and how they work in the following sources: Project Recovery1, Separate versus dedicated process2, Dedicated process, Separate process, or buggy mode?3. This will help you understand the implications of running an FX as either a separate process or a dedicated process in Reaper DAW.

    Does that help?

  • phillip2637
    phillip2637 Member Posts: 24 Member

    Kontakt 8 did not have full disk access; it does now. The other apps were set correctly.

    Dedicated process and separate process not only have extensive delays on save and close, but aren't actually functional. The FX window with KK and the library appears, but page selectors (main, editor, mixer) toggle highlighting on clicks and do nothing else. The key switch buttons show selected state without presenting their patterns (stuck on C0).

    I've verified that the UI still works as expected on Automatic.

    I have been able to force a crash report by doing "kill -6" during a hung save of a test project. If there's a way to get that to you (if it's of any value), let me know how.

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,941 admin

    @phillip2637 There's a known issue with Reaper and Komplete Kontrol, does it sound/look like what you're experiencing?

    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/18432/using-komplete-kontrol-causing-my-daw-reaper-to-freeze-every-5-minutes-kbdsw-7859
  • phillip2637
    phillip2637 Member Posts: 24 Member

    I do not experience crashes and the freeze is long but temporary (about one minute). It's also triggered by specific actions — either an explicit save or closing the FX window — rather than "every 5 minutes". It doesn't seem very similar.

    What appears to be happening with me is that Reaper/KK/Kontakt are running a read/write loop on the main thread of the process. That makes Reaper unresponsive, but it does finish and start working again if I leave it alone.

    If I were to guess, based on the stack trace, I'd say that Kontakt is trying to copy library samples for some reason while saving its settings. (Names like 'storeComponentState', 'BBank::writeSlotList', and 'BMonolith::MonolithBase::LocateSample' show up in the traceback.) Like I said, just guessing.

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,941 admin
    Answer ✓

    I've contacted you by email regarding this issue.

  • phillip2637
    phillip2637 Member Posts: 24 Member
    Answer ✓

    I have just tried three tests with the Kontakt update, where I expected all or most of them to reproduce the problem. They did not! Save and close times were quite reasonable.

    If I do get a repeat, I'll get back in touch about it, but for now it looks like a fix.

    Thanks for your help!

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