Can spare PSU make Maschine+ unstable, too…?

MaikR
MaikR Member Posts: 377 Guru
edited October 2024 in Maschine

It seems there’s a problem with the / my alternative Power Supply offered by NI, when used with the M+.

I’m using this one when I take my Maschine Plus from the studio. Especially start-up and loading times are much longer or it even get stuck.

https://www.native-instruments.com/en/pricing/power-supply-40-w/

This power supply can be used without a lock feature and can therefore also be used for Maschine+ units.


Same wifi, no other devices connected, so just the M+ and this other PSU. The original PSU (the one with the lock connector) seems to keep it much more stable.

There’s no difference in stability with for instance my Audio4c audio interface, because the M+ drops the connection at random on both PSUs. So it’s mainly the startup, and sometimes shutdown or standard operation.

Does someone else use this type of PSU with the Maschine+, too? And is the original PSU somewhere available, as NI doesn’t seem to have or get it back in stock?

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Comments

  • ozon
    ozon Member Posts: 1,910 Expert
    edited August 2024

    Yep, that PSU doesn’t work properly for the M+. A couple of years ago, I had some back and forth with NI support about this.

    Fact is the barrel connector doesn’t properly match and therefore does provide proper contact.

    I still have some pics and videos here that shows the problem.

    IMG_6516.jpeg

    https://youtube.com/shorts/0gh5ua8P7cc?si=yc21_rIJjO68J1Dp

  • MaikR
    MaikR Member Posts: 377 Guru

    Humm… indeed, same happening here when slightly wiggling the connector.

    Then I don’t know why NI is advertising it as a proper replacement for the M+.

    Could a output difference in mA also influence stability or would that also be related to the connector?

    I can understand that wiggling the connector could break the connection entirely, but how would that explain unreliable performance while connected?

  • ozon
    ozon Member Posts: 1,910 Expert
    edited August 2024

    Then I don’t know why NI is advertising it as a proper replacement for the M+.

    Neither do I nor does support.

    It’s simply not fit for the purpose.

    As you can see from some other threads about using batteries to power the M+, there are quite a few people who experienced M+ instability when not providing clean power as specified.

    My assumption is that the connector doesn’t make sufficiently stable contact and there’s always tiny cutouts when operating the unit. Or the contact surface is so tiny that it limits the available current, so the M+ doesn’t receive the power (wattage) its processor requires.

  • MaikR
    MaikR Member Posts: 377 Guru
    edited August 2024

    Interesting… and if so, what would be a proper alternative? As NI doesn’t have an original replacement in stock for a couple of years now, so the chance that it will become available again is quite low.

  • ozon
    ozon Member Posts: 1,910 Expert
    edited August 2024

    The original PSU has never been available as spare part, yet it’s delivered with every new Maschine+. Quite the mystery.

    As an alternative, you have to find a PSU with the same specs which allows to attach a cable which has a barrel connector that looks exactly like the one for the M+ (with visible spring contact prongs, left in the picture).

    There are some USB-C trigger cables which are build like that. So, any PSU adhering to PD 2.0 USB-C standard and a 15V trigger cable should do. You’ll find more details on solutions in the M+ power bank threads.

    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/7883/maschine-power-bank-guide

  • Cretin Dilettante
    Cretin Dilettante Member Posts: 221 Pro

    Yet another reason "consumer protections" are important in the music tech field. That's kinda disturbing, that there isn't an exact replacement for their flagship standalone's PSU. Even if I were rich, I wouldn't want to buy a second unit to get a locking barrel connector.

  • D-One
    D-One Moderator Posts: 3,627 mod
    edited August 2024

    This is why it should have been a USB-C instead of a hard to find connector type and size… It makes it so easy to replace both the cable and power brick.

    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/170172#Comment_170172

    I am not an expert but afaik a poor contact/connection can cause volt/amp to drop… Usage wear and corrosion can make it worse - On a computer this can cause general instability, inability to boot, random crashes, etc…

    If i lost my PSU I'd consider 3 options:

    1 - Buy a USB-C 30/40W charger (for phone, tablet, etc, need to check if can deliver 15V) and respective 15V PD trigger cable as the ones we use for powerbanks:

    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/7883/maschine-power-bank-guide

    The hardest part would probably be finding a PD trigger cable long enough, they are ussually somewhat short.

    2 - Find a connector that matches the size specs, cut the wire of the current one you got or any compatible one make your own. Could go a step above and use a locking one like the original (twist lock), i think it's this one:

    https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Kycon/KLDX-PA-0202-B-LT?qs=9%2Fra8%252BGZ9lbWNDvFPz44jg%3D%3D

    Or this

    https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CUI-Devices/PP-2555TL-M?qs=yqaQSyyJnNh3SOyms3uLZA%3D%3D

    I cant recommend this to everyone as switching the polarity by mistake can be disastrous (?).

    3 - Demand that NI sends/sells you something that works, ideally the original power brick.

  • D-One
    D-One Moderator Posts: 3,627 mod
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/170198#Comment_170198

    There are tons, just not enough yet, especially globally. As usual we have to wait for the EU to force things and set the example.

    AFAIK This falls into whatever the laws for "Electronic devices" are where you live, the fact that it makes music or coffee is irrelevant. As I understand "right to repair" covers everything "essential for the device to function" and a power brick falls into this category, then again theres a whole aftermarket of universal power supplies…

    So not sure this is a priority expect for proprietary connectors, something the EU already took care of in the famous case of the iPhone, aswell as pushing USB-C.

  • MaikR
    MaikR Member Posts: 377 Guru
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/170282#Comment_170282

    I don’t know if @Matthew_NI @Kai_NI @Simon_NI @Kaiwan_NI are also aware of this, and are in contact with the product team and/or purchase team to get this PSU in stock? As there seem ‘new’ devices been made (the ones that have the new logo) this particular PSU should also be in production.

    An alternative solution would be an adapter cable or piece that would fit the available alternative power supply for all other NI gear…?

    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/34422/can-spare-psu-make-maschine-unstable-too

    I can see the benefit of this turn-to-lock connector, but if there are no replacement PSUs and the ‘regular’ ones do make the Maschine+ operate unstable, then there has to be offered a decent solution.

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