Why no random preset button in Komplete Kontrol?

anthony-1979
anthony-1979 Member Posts: 23 Sine
edited March 15 in Komplete Kontrol

Hi there,

I have over 58,000 instrument presets in my komplete kontrol and it always starts off with the same preset. Why can't I randomise these search results so that I can hear something other than --INIT-- and [PRIS]1? lmfao?

Like is this for real? Do I really always need to always have foresight of what tag/instrument i wish to select to change up my results and even THEN the first preset in the list of returned results is always the same one? When my piano results return 5000 presets, it's not nice to always be presented with the exact same piano right on the top of the list as I last got when I used the exact same tags.

I find myself constantly being forced to use the same sounds when quickly trying to lay down ideas. After having 58,000 to choose from, yes the same sounds are being used because even though I have the ability to sit there scrolling down for minutes on end to hear some new stuff I really shouldn't have to or want to.

Does anybody have any thoughts? It really cannot be that 58,000 sounds can only be layed out alphabetically. I thought KK was supposed to "open" the pallet not keep it closed off to the same sounds. I know I'm supposed to pick "characters" and "instruments" but in music 101, having foresight really only happens on lucky days if anybody here knows what I'm talking about.

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Comments

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 680 Saw

    I has been discussed here quite recently. Something like go to random sample would be nice. Randomization would make things simpler and flow smoother....

    Now, one may scroll somewhere and try few patches and scroll again. Some people jump by pages, several times...

  • anthony-1979
    anthony-1979 Member Posts: 23 Sine
    edited March 9

    It would be all you said and it would literally be "life" itself if it had random preset button. Scrap that, just an option to turn the "results" into random order so that way you can still use tags to narrow down to piano but you get a different list each time! Think of how Omnisphere does it. Imagine all the new sounds that would just be suddenly accessible. And it would make music making fun again to not have to hear the same "thrill" cinematic stomps right at the beginning of the list every single time.

    Oh trust me I scroll, but believe it or not even the scrolls become the same length after a while and land me in the exact same area I always land on! It's all flawed unless there is true randomisation. Way too many presets to be accessing them alphabetically. You can scroll for days and never hear >80% of the sounds available.

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 680 Saw

    Jump to random position is easier to implement (several hours of work, say one day including changes in user manual and so on.). And randomized order of presets would not fit all people.

    It would work on filtered presets, so no problem to narrow down to preset subset.

  • anthony-1979
    anthony-1979 Member Posts: 23 Sine
  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 680 Saw

    I could, if I worked in NI, but I do not. But I am a programmer and so I can guess, more or less, how much work such a thing represents.

    I would appreciate something like random position changes, I also have thousands of patches. Just Massive X has 2000+ presets (including Preset Expansions).

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Custom NKS Libraries: freelancesoundlabs.com/nksMember Posts: 402 Saw

    I have over 600,000 presets so I feel your pain.

    Random for me is to set the scroll bar in KK to a random point then use PG UP/DN and arrows to make it land in a random spot BUT after 7 years of asking for this seemingly simple function (along with a raft of other no-brainer simple things) i've accepted NI aren't interested at all in what users want, only in whatever their own vision is because not a single suggestion in all this time from users has been implemented. It's a good suggestion made hundreds of times already, but I wouldn't hold your breath on it ever being reality.

  • anthony-1979
    anthony-1979 Member Posts: 23 Sine


    I guess all we can do is keep this post alive and hope that others join and it becomes a bit of a "thing". I honestly feel this is something that every single user struggles with and if enough people chime in here with their opinions in this "new" forum you never know, we may get some traction, NI sees it and decides to implement it. I'm not holding my breath as you say but I can only dream I guess. And while they're at it they can also let the user re-tag the official content. Not asking for custom "tags" as that would get messy but at least let me use the existing tags to "Correct" the many badly tagged plugins with incorrect tags.

    Excuse my ignorance but how do you do "page up/down"? Is that simply holding shift on the keyboard while scrolling and it leaps further down the list? If so, it still moves down slow as hell and I'll NEVER get to hear the presets even a quarter of the way down the list of 58,000 presets. I can only imagine how much of a nightmare this is for you with 600,000!!

    Let's just keep making some noise guys. Once this is implemented it will be what it was always meant to be and also it will be like the seas have parted!

  • anthony-1979
    anthony-1979 Member Posts: 23 Sine


    They're already onto the "random" era in some of their plugs but honestly it's far less useful as a synth parameter randomiser than it is as a random preset selector. How can they not see this? I really hope someone over there is watching this space.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Custom NKS Libraries: freelancesoundlabs.com/nksMember Posts: 402 Saw

    Yeah "flogging a dead horse" is the term that comes to mind.

    You kind of give up hope after almost a decade of zero change. I've just learned to live with it since i'm actually not a preset junkie, I use the few instruments I know and like and that's kind of it for me. I only have that many presets because I make NKS compatibility libraries but many instruments I have barely used myself.

    Yes all I do is use page up/down keys and then arrow keys (on the computer keyboard) as I find the browsing on the keyboard itself to be limited. This is probably why they haven't added a "random" function as yet because they would have to somehow make it accessible from the KB. Seems simple to make something like Shift and Down/Up. I half blame Apple tho as they have caused almost all development of the last 2 years to be focused around fu$&!n logic and macOS compatibility, has been a big reason not much else has been done.

  • anthony-1979
    anthony-1979 Member Posts: 23 Sine

    Wow I had no idea things were as back-seated as you say. I'm not a preset junkie either but I'd love to hear these 58,000 sounds I have that seem nice and "tucked away" for the moment lol.

    Is there a specific feature request forum or something? Or is this it?

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Custom NKS Libraries: freelancesoundlabs.com/nksMember Posts: 402 Saw
    edited March 10

    Well on the old forum there was a feature suggestion thread with 48 pages of suggestions since 2014.... So far I think maybe zero of those have been implemented in all that time, hence the amount of optimism I have for any improvements moving forward.

    Only features in all that time (that is 8 years) that does NOT include compatibility and basic functionality enhancements (such as releasing the MK2 keyboard without ability to integrate into most DAWs like MK1):

    • Sound Previews (which no one actually requested but was a good feature)
    • Sampler (which again, no one asked for and is rather limited with ability to load just a single sample
    • VST FX (which again was never requested and is pretty crippled as you cannot save an instrument + effects chain or even automate loaded effects)

    That is about it.

    Actually, there has been MORE features lost than gained since the initial release of the MK1 keyboard:

    • You cannot switch off the lightguide at all on the MK2 (could MK1)
    • MK1 had the ability to set the touch strips to all kinds of useful LFO operations such as ping-pong, no gravity etc

    You can see the whole release cycle history here:

    https://www.native-instruments.com/forum/threads/official-update-status-komplete-kontrol-current-2-6-6.255928/

    Almost every release is just adding support for the latest keyboards, adding support (or more fixing) for DAWs or patching issues caused by macOS.

    This is ultimately why there is probably no feature request thread here because it's always just been an ignored black hole for users to dispose of useful suggestions and yes, my tone is a reflection of my disappointment over the last 8 years on this topic!

  • anthony-1979
    anthony-1979 Member Posts: 23 Sine

    I totally get your disappointment. It's not right that NI don't implement user suggestions/requests. They have amazing, innovative ideas that if only were combined with user ideas it would actually be next level.

    I personally feel that you should start an attention-grabbing thread about your disappointment. Expressing with specific points like you've made here. That will be probably be seen more than this thread here about a very typical topic like "random presets". I feel NI should be very aware of the points you've made and if you get some traction there from other users, it might be seen by NI.

    That all being said, I don't blame you if you feel unenthused about doing such a thing as you seem like you've been around here long enough to know their tendencies. I guess it can't hurt to write a public letter to NI so that others can jump on the bandwagon.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Custom NKS Libraries: freelancesoundlabs.com/nksMember Posts: 402 Saw

    Ha, I like how you assume I have not already done that a number of times not just on the old forum in numerous threads, in the beta testing area, direct to NI employees via email and also via skype video call.... Short of flying over there, grabbing the code and programming in some features myself, I have exhausted my approaches as far as I CBF!

    I'm over it TBH, I just use what I can from what I have and just don't purchase any content anymore, haven't for years and unlikely I will because it's not that the features I want aren't being considered, it is that nothing any user has said has suggested has ever been hinted at being considered.

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 680 Saw

    I guess, NI did impement some of users demanded. For example clips, and possibly few more things....

    On the other side, I do not understant why some really simple to implement and usefull things like preset random jump has not been added. It is one manday at most.... 500-700 EUR, or so.

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