Advice on 100+ KK on Orch template

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Maxhombre
Maxhombre Member Posts: 51 Member
edited June 2023 in Komplete Kontrol

Hi Ni people,

I have a 2020 iMac 3.6ghz i9 / 128gb ram / Kontakt 7

I’ve had a few years of problems with my Mac suffice to say the Logic board and SSD is being changed by Apple.

I run a large Logic Pro orchestral template, 150+ channels preloaded instruments and then turned off in the template using dynamic allocation. Or is it more stable to just run it in my Kontakt 7 but I’ll miss control over presets and controlling software synths

my questions are:

Q1: is it safe to run 100 preloaded instances of Komplete Kontrol so I have full control of my software via my S88mk2?

Q:2: I previously divided my 2tb drive into two 1TB partitions, just spoke to Apple they said no benefit in this and can cause read/write errors. Where is best to store my 700gb of orchestral library? Ie my name>music>make a folder for my sample library? I could see problems with iCloud if I make a folder on the desktop what to do?

Q3: I use Ni Cremona Quartet is it better to use this in a multi timbal Kontakt setup? And how easy is that as I’ve never done that?

any help appreciated


maxhombre

Best Answers

  • Sunborn
    Sunborn NKS User Library Mod Posts: 2,600 mod
    Answer ✓
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    You're welcome :-)

    Please also click the "accepted answer" button, thank you.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,757 Expert
    Answer ✓
    Options

    Q1: is it safe to run 100 preloaded instances of Komplete Kontrol so I have full control of my software via my S88mk2?

    I have seen users claim they can run this many instances but it all depends on what is loaded and how many are in use. If I was going to attempt to do anything like a large template like this of any kind I would do it in stages and create multiple saved versions along the way, add 10 tracks, test with the first load of instruments and if all is good, make a copy and add another 10 and repeat. Personally I make instrument racks of pre-loaded groups of instruments which I can then add into a project so for things like orchestral stuff instead of having a full orchestra of instruments for something you may only need a horn section for, you create the sections and save them as groups which you can just add in when needed. That is just my preference tho

    Q:2: I previously divided my 2tb drive into two 1TB partitions, just spoke to Apple they said no benefit in this and can cause read/write errors. Where is best to store my 700gb of orchestral library? Ie my name>music>make a folder for my sample library? I could see problems with iCloud if I make a folder on the desktop what to do?

    Well, either Apple are clueless or they fear their OS is problematic but there should never be an issue in partitioning a drive, it is just splitting a volume and especially for things like sample library storage where it is almost exclusively for reading data, seems an odd thing for them to say. However, unless you need partitioned volumes for some specific reason there is no benefit to making multiple partitions, just have a drive, make a folder and place all your libraries in it. All that is needed, just make sure you format the drive correctly for macs:

    https://support.native-instruments.com/hc/en-us/articles/214134545-Notes-on-Hard-Drive-Formats-on-Mac-Computers

    Q3: I use Ni Cremona Quartet is it better to use this in a multi timbal Kontakt setup? And how easy is that as I’ve never done that?

    Not familiar with this one but if you want to add multiple layers in Kontakt the issue will be Komplete Kontrol will only ever see the controls for layer 1 so it will probably mean you lose a heap of functionality doing it that way.

  • Brad Yost
    Brad Yost Member Posts: 354 Pro
    edited June 2023 Answer ✓
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    @Maxhombre

    re: Q3

    I would highly recommend that you create a track & instance of KK for each instrument and save it as a track (subset) template so that you will have access to all of the keyswitches & knobs in each active instantiation. You'll be glad you did, for the reasons that @JesterMgee mentioned.

    PS: my largest orchestration project templates have up to 127 tracks containing 100+ KK/Kontakt inserts and Spitfire VST's. It's possible if your machine is robust [mine is I9 with 64Gb ram on Win10].

Answers

  • Sunborn
    Sunborn NKS User Library Mod Posts: 2,600 mod
    edited June 2023
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    Q1: I don't think anyone can answer this. It depends on many things, Some computers might handle it, some others might crash. The only way to be sure, is to experiment with your own machine. You can start with a lower number, lets say 50 instances and see if your system can handle more. However there is probably a better way to do this! For example, only 10 instances, each one with 10 instruments loaded.

    Q2: Yes there is absolutely no benefit on this! Unless you want it just for backups. Library: Best practice is to have them all together, in different sub folders of course and even better, if you use a separate disc for them, maybe an external one. The main benefit on this, is that you never loose them (not even need to reinstall most of them) and easily move them across other computers or on a new one.

    Q3: Don't know that instrument but as a general rule, multi-timbral is almost always the best choice. A multi-timbral instrument can produce sounds on multiple channels at once. A multi-timbral instrument is often used to perform several instruments simultaneously, such as on a workstation keyboard which plays ensemble arrangements. For example, Channel 1 might be a piano, Channel 2 a guitar, Channel 3 a bass, etc.

  • Maxhombre
    Maxhombre Member Posts: 51 Member
    edited June 2023
    Options

    hi Sunborn

    many thanks for your response, yes I can see that running things in multitimbral would be the way to go. I’m currently preloading and using Logic track stacks.

    is there a way to load one instance of Komplete Kontrol use the 25 part multitimbral and pre load say my Arturia V Collection? And I’m guessing if the instrument is turned off/ inactive it wouldn’t use ram via Logic dynamic allocation?, I can see that it’s easy to work multimbrally in Kontakt 7 but then I lose the preset / soft synth CC control of my S88mk2.

    Also if not using Mac partitions where would the best place be to keep all my Ni/VSL/ Spitfire/ Project Sam / Sonuscore big libraries? ( I would prefer to keep them all on the iMac HD) and I suppose these can be housed in a Logic track stack to keep things tidy?

  • Sunborn
    Sunborn NKS User Library Mod Posts: 2,600 mod
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    I don't think there is a 25-part multi-T device out there! As far as i know 16 is the maximum (yet some hardware may have 32)

    About Logic i have no idea, i use Cubase.

    Partitions: best place is a second SSL drive (either internal or external), but i you prefer to keep them all on the iMac HD, then there is no choice at all... any place of the drive is as good as any other place :-)

  • Maxhombre
    Maxhombre Member Posts: 51 Member
    Options

    Many thanks for your help Sunborn.

  • Sunborn
    Sunborn NKS User Library Mod Posts: 2,600 mod
    Answer ✓
    Options

    You're welcome :-)

    Please also click the "accepted answer" button, thank you.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,757 Expert
    Answer ✓
    Options

    Q1: is it safe to run 100 preloaded instances of Komplete Kontrol so I have full control of my software via my S88mk2?

    I have seen users claim they can run this many instances but it all depends on what is loaded and how many are in use. If I was going to attempt to do anything like a large template like this of any kind I would do it in stages and create multiple saved versions along the way, add 10 tracks, test with the first load of instruments and if all is good, make a copy and add another 10 and repeat. Personally I make instrument racks of pre-loaded groups of instruments which I can then add into a project so for things like orchestral stuff instead of having a full orchestra of instruments for something you may only need a horn section for, you create the sections and save them as groups which you can just add in when needed. That is just my preference tho

    Q:2: I previously divided my 2tb drive into two 1TB partitions, just spoke to Apple they said no benefit in this and can cause read/write errors. Where is best to store my 700gb of orchestral library? Ie my name>music>make a folder for my sample library? I could see problems with iCloud if I make a folder on the desktop what to do?

    Well, either Apple are clueless or they fear their OS is problematic but there should never be an issue in partitioning a drive, it is just splitting a volume and especially for things like sample library storage where it is almost exclusively for reading data, seems an odd thing for them to say. However, unless you need partitioned volumes for some specific reason there is no benefit to making multiple partitions, just have a drive, make a folder and place all your libraries in it. All that is needed, just make sure you format the drive correctly for macs:

    https://support.native-instruments.com/hc/en-us/articles/214134545-Notes-on-Hard-Drive-Formats-on-Mac-Computers

    Q3: I use Ni Cremona Quartet is it better to use this in a multi timbal Kontakt setup? And how easy is that as I’ve never done that?

    Not familiar with this one but if you want to add multiple layers in Kontakt the issue will be Komplete Kontrol will only ever see the controls for layer 1 so it will probably mean you lose a heap of functionality doing it that way.

  • Brad Yost
    Brad Yost Member Posts: 354 Pro
    edited June 2023 Answer ✓
    Options

    @Maxhombre

    re: Q3

    I would highly recommend that you create a track & instance of KK for each instrument and save it as a track (subset) template so that you will have access to all of the keyswitches & knobs in each active instantiation. You'll be glad you did, for the reasons that @JesterMgee mentioned.

    PS: my largest orchestration project templates have up to 127 tracks containing 100+ KK/Kontakt inserts and Spitfire VST's. It's possible if your machine is robust [mine is I9 with 64Gb ram on Win10].

  • Maxhombre
    Maxhombre Member Posts: 51 Member
    edited June 2023
    Options

    Many thanks guys much appreciated for the info and I will continue with my large preloaded Logic startup song template with its 100+ tracks, the problems I have been having are a long time random fault and crashes with the Logic board and drive on my iMac which is being replaced. Prior to that it was faulty ram that made the computer fall over, From what you’ve advised on getting back my computer from Apple I will restore from Time Machine ( I reinstalled everything from scratch for a clean TM backup) and copy the library into a folder in the Music area on the Mac as I was told by Apple that having the library folder on the desktop would mean iCloud would back up the library as well in the iCloud backup.

    I think that my iMac i9 3.6ghz with 128gb ram should be able to cope but my problem all along was the previously faulty ram chip and now the faulty Logic board and drive as prior to it going back to Apple again more recently library had started disappearing and in KK if I browsed content on S88mk2 it had disappeared and just wasn’t there anymore? Of course two years of Kernel Panic crashes and racing fans and machine shutdowns Apple just try to quick fix things and all along I’ve thought the Logic template was just too big and I’d only be using a few instruments and the machine would be falling over, (. Of course insts we’re off and dynamic allocation turned on in Logic) and this time after three times in the Apple service center they finally said we’ll swap out drive and Logic board which could fix a lot of problems I was having. I really apreciate this forum Thankyou so much but I’ve been struggling with a faulty iMac thinking it was my large Logic template, I just want a preloaded system that reduces thinking time when I have an idea, I want to open a track stack turn on an instrument and go so as not to lose the moment. Thankyou so much for taking the time to share your advice much apreciated as I’ve been living in hell.

    as a side note where I lived I politely asked a noisy neighbour and her children to stop jumping on the wooden floor she had laid in her flat above me after living with it for a few years ( I only ever worked on headphones) and it turned out she came from a criminal family and the whole family turned up to murder me, I was under siege for days and I eventually managed to run from my flat and it’s been nearly two years since I’ve lived there, I still pay the rent but cannot return yet, police are not interested unless you’ve been attacked, I know if you are stressed you can output static and electrical equipment can fail as It happened to me once before my thought is this stress and fear for my life with ten people keeping me in a siege situation for three days ultimately affected the iMac which has never worked properly the ram failed, the drive has just failed and now the Logic board it’s sounds madcap but that’s my story. I

    Many thanks again for your advice more apreciated than you could ever know.

  • Maxhombre
    Maxhombre Member Posts: 51 Member
    Options

    How would I preload KK instruments of say String sections put it in a track stack and then save it as a subset/ template as Brad suggests?

    im currently struggling with trying to make a multimbral Kontakt instrument just cannot get it to work and on the Kontakt output on the instrument it only gives me the option for 7:1 surround sound the option for main outputs just isn’t there?I’ve looked at four YouTube videos on the subject and cannot get a multimbral Kontakt to work?

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