RIP the old forum
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yeah i looked up soundwide and didn't get the impression of something meant to overtake reaktor at all. all i know is i've never really considered using another development environment before but depending on how all this shakes out will inform whether or not it seems like a good idea to pack up what i've learned here and seek for greener pastures 🤷♀️
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In fact, removing the old forum was not only a strange decision, but it was bad for the Reaktor community... Not only did it not help the community, it killed it by 80%... Also, deleting the old forum really shows how low the value of the experience and knowledge shared over the years by the members of the old forum is to NI... I no longer have any desire to contribute to the community... And I'm sure I'm not the only one.
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It could be just a "coincidence" but for sure some of the actual issues with Reaktor could be fixed with this so I still believe in the future some of the SoundStacks development (CMajor) could hit Reaktor as environment.
OK @Mutis, just for giggles lets play along with your conspiracy theory... Please explain how Reaktor could be 'fixed' with Soundstacks environment. And also explain how an environment that doesn't fully exist yet and is targeted at professional audio software developers, could 'hit' an environment that is targeted squarely at non programmers, particularly musicians?
It means the old forum deprecation is directly related to this? I hope not but maybe if this "assumption" is right (catch the SoundWide wave let's say...) then maybe abandon some of these resources could have some logic behind.
Now please explain how these
far fetched fantasieshypotheses are connected to changes in the forum that were really just a consequence of a change at the top forum level?The likely reality is, NI decided to change the way their 'community' pages function, Reaktor forum is part of that so was part of the changes. The old forum was not compatible, and making it compatible was unfortunately going to use more resources that are are available for Reaktor (it would have been a huge job, and however it was done, folk would have criticised the result)
I guess in theory they could have kept a read only archive available, but that would have meant keeping the old forum code on the server and all the baggage goes along with that, which would also have to be maintained... then there's the problem that if you do it for Reaktor, then you would have to be open to similar demands from users of all your other softwares if similar things happen in the future... not an appealing commitment for a company with such a large catalogue.
I imagine if it was just the Reaktor forum, they might have chosen a new forum platform that allowed a proper migration from the old one. But it's not, and the Reaktor builder community was not a high enough priority to influence that decision.
That's the reality here, not some conspiracy to soften up the community in preparation for the great SoundStacks takeover ;)
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How does the fact that you have the back ups make any difference when users make a request for specific threads like I did a few posts back and there is no reaction at all?
I do get the idea about starting from scratch, hell I even would like R7 to break compatibility in order to get rid of primary. But even then the old forum would be a valuable knowledge base. The wealth of knowledge buried there is invaluable for those passionate about Reaktor. I don't get it. One day you think NI is passionate about Reaktor because they finally get the very complicated transition to native M1 and VST3 done. The other day they kill everything their customers have ever communicated about Reaktor. Its like running the church and burning the bible at the same time.
Looking forward to many more "the future of reaktor" threads.
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If this goes on, it is quite possible that very soon we will see a topic called "RIP the Reaktor". ...
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I applaud the eye for pattern matching but its speculative and at this point kind of steering the original thread off topic. i think a more appropriate place to build your case would be in a new thread?
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I totally agree... Especially from someone who is not a Reaktorist (doesn't create anything in Reaktor at the DSP level), but creates only too many words without having studied Reaktor Core basics....This is very similar to the Dunning-Kruger effect ...
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I didn't catch that sorry - that thread is not about the old forum anymore btw and so if you want us to react, it might be better to keep in on topic.
I already mentioned that we want to make the entire "Building with Reaktor" section available (and the Kontakt Scripting) but this still requires more work from dev teams and unfortunately, we can't make threads available on an individual basis until then.
With that said, a fair amount is available on archive. I don't have the title of the threads you are looking for but I found one on advanced serialisation: https://web.archive.org/web/20220825044230/https://www.native-instruments.com/forum/threads/toolset-for-advanced-serialization-and-iteration.143726/
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You missed the point entirely right? nobody wanted two communities, just an archive of all the old data that has now gone, along with most of the users who created that old data, learning Reaktor just became much more of a chore that will put off most users, and is a bit worrying for the platforms future.
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Maybe read my previous post :
I already mentioned that we want to make the entire "Building with Reaktor" section available (and the Kontakt Scripting) but this still requires more work from dev teams.
I also already mentioned that we would make more content available if there is enough interest. Learning Reaktor is still possible and accessible. You have a community here with more questions being answered than in the old forum and you have a Discord channel ran by Evil Dragon geared towards builders.
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If you check the videos they are talking about code deployment so agnostic that could be a possible fixing for the vst3 issues pointed at beta topic.
Q: how does a new, different language make it easy to fix a huge very old code base created in a completely different language?
In fact that’s the whole aim of SoundStacks building a foundation language where build software on top. If you know Reaktor history it’s very similar.
Reaktor was not initially a development language for DSP - not even close.
I remember when Reaktor was new. It was exciting to see a virtual modular synthesis system on PC, but not so interesting to me exactly because it was not a development environment. I chose sinc modular instead because that was more of a DSP development environment. Years later, NI brought in the creator of Sinc Modular, and they introduced that tech as 'core'. That's when I made the switch. Some point after that, NI did start to ship products developed in core, but Reaktor was a very mature product by then.
Sound stacks unnamed vapourware product is very different from Reaktor in so many ways, I'm surprised you are so focussed on equating the two!
The thing is SoundStacks stated their development as “internal tool later released to public” and that capture among comments in the first video point towards “box and arrow” paradigm (max, reaktor, vvvv…) as one of the ways to interact.
Maybe you were not listening closely. They specifically stated that they would definitely be using a C style language syntax. They did briefly mention graphical arranging, but only at a much higher level than the DSP code.
My bet is “In some moment Reaktor will be integrated into SoundStacks and after that new SoundStacks Reaktor will be released to the public”. I will say 3 years.
It doesn't make sense to integrate Reaktor into Sound stacks, as stated, the low level coding in sound stacks will be C style syntax, and the low level core part of Reaktor is really the only thing worth keeping if you were going to reuse Reaktor tech. Not sure why NI would give that tech to a different company anyway - would be a bad move. Too many of their products are based on it, and they would lose control of it.
...If NI were to start using the Sound Stacks product as a development tool, then it would be possible to rewrite Reaktor using that language, but highly unlikely due to the massive resources required. And also the fact that the the tricky bit of Reaktor is not audio DSP at all, Reaktor core is a compiler. So using a language specifically designed to optimise audio DSP doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
You should go and watch the Sound Stacks vid again a bit more carefully before commenting further on this ;)
Just out of interest, they said in the vid that we would hear more soon, but that was something like 9 months ago. Is there more news?, how is the project developing?
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thanks for that!
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I am learning Reaktor, I was learning by reading old posts on the old forum (rarely in building with Reaktor by the way) there is very little content in this forum for people like me, yes I have had help in the Discord from ED, but reality about that Discord is that it is mostly advanced builders that don't have much time (rightly so, people have lives) to be a support network for something that is, actually, a very deep and complex topic, building in Reaktor, and it is also worth noting that even though those guys are advanced, want to guess how often I ask what seems like a basic question, and nobody knows the answer (again, a very deep and complex subject) but I have found an answer by scouring the old forum.
I am not asking for customer support, or help building in most instances, just access to the many years of backdated knowledge of the old forum that may have come in a small comment here or small comment there in an unrelated thread.
If it is a space issue, I am happy to donate space for it, no charge, no strings, no worries.
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I hadn't seen the most recent vid. I have now though, and I still don't see anything to suggest that C Major is aimed at the same demographic as Reaktor.
If NI decide to retire Reaktor, then I don't think that would be related in any way to C Major happening. They will or they wont based on whether it still gives a return on their investment of resources.
From what I can see, C Major looks fantastic, and as a software developer, it looks like something I will be exploring further, but the Reaktor user base is a different set of folk. There is only a small overlap on that venn diagram. When core was released in Reaktor 5, there was a lot of negativity about how difficult it was. Also in general, Reaktor gets a bad rap for being overly complex, particularly to learn. C Major is already orders of magnitude more complex to get started in. So much for folk to understand and learn if they are not already programmers.
Even if the promised (but still unseen?) graphical interface simplifies some stuff, there is a lot of developer jargon to parse to even understand how everything fits together. I really don't see it taking the place of Reaktor, it looks like a different thing that can live happily along side Reaktor and serve a whole different group of people.
Based on the info in the recent vid, I still think that the idea that NI removing access to the old Reaktor forum could have anything at all to do with Sound Stacks or C Major is ridiculous conspiracy theory nonsense!
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Matthieux, where is the link to the forum rules? On searching "forum rules" I got no result.
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