Any future Komplete Kontrol S88 mk2 firmware update ?
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@M_7 If you read my “long” post (which is only about a third longer than your post) _you would see that I bought the mk3 in January (and I’m very happy with it)
Saying I ignored reality and lived on hope because of rumours …..
Nope. I was pointing out that according to what NI actually said, they have only stopped supporting the mk1. No rumours, that’s fact. See their email below. And I also said that if they were no longer supplying any updates to the mk2 (not talking about new features that only work on the mk3) then really they’ve stopped support for the mk2 as well (I still said that as far as I was aware, support is still ongoing for it)
Comparing musical instruments with phones is like comparing apples to oranges. I only buy a new phone if my old one dies and is uneconomical for me to repair. Both my current iPhone and my current iPad Pro came out in 2018 and both were bought 2nd hand in the past couple of years. if I got the latest models today, there is nothing I would want to do on them that I can’t already do on my 6 year old models.
Phones have become a fashion item, about 99% of the population do exactly the same things on their latest phones that they did 5 years ago on their older ones, they have absolutely zero real need to upgrade (of course it’s their choice).Regardless , if I bought a phone today and next week they announced it was being replaced by a new model, my model would still be supported with security updates and new features for usually many years to come. They don’t announce a new model and immediately stop updating and adding features to the previous one.
You bought your mk2 at a great price because the mk3 is out. My comments were about those who bought the mk2 a couple of weeks or so before the mk3 was announced, hence they expected to be buying a product that would still be supported for a few years (again, if you buy an apple product and it’s discontinued, it will receive updates for many years). And again as far as I’m aware, it is still supported.
I’m very happy with my mk3, sure there’s things I wished it had. But overall I’m pleased with my purchase. However, if you were a mk2 user and used its Maschine integration, you might not be so happy as they’ve removed this capability from the mk3.
Anyway have fun with your mk2
Email from NI
——————————----------We’re writing to let you know we will be ending software support for MK1 of the Komplete Kontrol S-Series keyboard controller on October 12, 2023.
Starting with the upcoming release of Komplete Kontrol 3.0, future NI software releases will no longer be compatible with the MK1. Please do not attempt an update to version 3.0when it is released on October 12.
You will still be able to use your MK1 keyboard with Komplete Kontrol 2.9 (or lower), which includes Apple Silicon and VST3 support. However, we will no longer maintain older versions of Komplete Kontrol and cannot guarantee they will be supported by future versions of your computer’s operating system.
We occasionally need to retire older products like the MK1 in order to focus our resources and development efforts on building new, innovative products and features. In this case, our decision comes alongside the launch of our new MK3 keyboards. With MK3, we are introducing next-generation software with many new features that require significant team resources. This means we are not able to continue working to maintain older versions.
We would like to thank you for your long-lasting commitment to Native Instruments and our Komplete Kontrol keyboards. Below, you’ll find a list of FAQs with detailed information on this change. If you have any further questions, please reach out to Native Instruments Customer Care for assistance.
Your team at NI
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What's going on these days with people demanding that anything and everything needs a firmware update?
😁
I guess because almost everyone has a computer and a smartphone now, and have become aware of updates to OS, BIOS, firmware, software, apps etc. that they start thinking they're entitled to updates, and therefore if something they buy doesn't get one………throw toys from pram NOW! 🤣
In the not so distant past, most members of the general public wouldn't even know what firmware was.
Now they've learned two new words - 'firmware' and 'update' - and this is the result! 🤐
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How is any of this any different from what you've encountered using your Apple or Windows computer? How many versions of either operating system have been "sunsetted" as they move forward with more expanded capabilities? That doesn't mean you can't still use them, but you won't get the benefit of the newer features and functions or the newer software designed to take advantage of them. That's because you don't design something based on the future features because the future features are determined in the future when the market shows an interest in something. You can't predict that accurately. You can guess, but you are VERY likely to guess wrong.
If you're not happy with the features of your older configuration you have the option to get newer stuff. That's why I'm not running Windows 95 on any of my computers. And I'm not driving a car with a carburetor rather than fuel injection either.
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My two cents - this is a uniquely Native Instruments problem considering their hardware has low value outside of usage with NKS instruments. It has very basic midi control capabilities, so there is a low price floor for a buyer that doesn’t have compatible software. I would have hoped NI beat Roland and Akai to the punch by creating some stand alone capabilities, but they haven’t and the catch-up is unlikely now imo. All this to say most NI hardware will eventually become a boat anchor because development of its software is perpetually advancing at a faster rate. Roland’s Fantom 0 series…Akai MPC Live 2 & Force all can be disconnected from wifi and function well in the future without any problems. Unfortunately, you have to know what you are getting into with NI.
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My two cents - I'm not worried in the least. This is a transition to a completely new architecture for a standard MIDI device and I've been down this road many times with other transformative intelligent devices. The one that really sticks out in my mind is the Line 6 Helix which was introduced and I purchased in 2015.
It was a modeler like their previous modelers but had a tremendous amount of additional processing power built in that would allow constant updates for new amp and effect models along with additional new capabilities that could be downloaded over time. And the architecture also allowed it to be scaled and hosted on other devices as well. The initial release was relatively sparse until the first update around 6 months later. By year two it had dwarfed most of it's competition with new features and new hosting options such as smaller devices such that they were leaving most of their competition behind.
Because of the dramatic change in the architecture, people with previous Line6 units couldn't port their projects to the new system. They could choose to stay on the older systems or update to the Helix and rebuild their projects under the new architecture if they wanted the new features and capabilities. Sound familiar?
So here we are 9 years later and there's a whole family of Helix based products for a range of different user needs. All compatible. All updateable. All on the same version releases. It took a while to get there, but by year 3 or 4 it was clear the strategy and capabilities were paying off. In terms of how that compares to this MK3 transition, we are just now at the point of the very first release of new capabilities that were significant for the Helix. So I'm not terribly worried.
Being a lifelong commercial software developer I understand what has to happen and be considered in developing to a new architecture. There's an old joke that was commonly cited back in the day:
How was God able to create the universe in only 7 days?
Answer: Because he didn't have an installed base.
We're now in that time period where patience will pay off.
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You are so right.
Nikon hasn't come out with a firmware update for my camera in 10 years. Shame on them!
Asus hasn't come out with a firmware update for my 2012 motherboard, and it's been 11 years for that. Shame on them!
I'm still on the Dewey Decimal system. I don't want to upgrade to UDC or LCC, and I'm going to picket my local libraries this weekend. Who's with me? We'll have t-shirts and signs!
And why don't we still use Windows ME and Windows 2000? And OS2 Warp?
If anybody's looking for me later, I'll be reading my Betty Crocker cookbook. Internet, schminternet. For MY rutabaga recipies, it's Betty Crocker or death! I just wish Betty Crocker would come out with a firmware update. 😏
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"Nikon hasn't come out with a firmware update for my camera in 10 years. Shame on them! Asus hasn't come out with a firmware update for my 2012 motherboard, and it's been 11 years for that. Shame on them!"
Unfortunately - in these times we live in - seems everyone now has a built in expectation (and entitlement) bias that assumes anything they buy needs to be "updated", "enhanced" or "improved" in some way - regardless of what they bought or when they bought it.
Whether it be hardware (like an S61 keyboard) or software (like Komplete Ultimate) - the expectation always seems to be:
I bought it and I expect to use it from the day of purchase until the end of time (for software) OR the end of it's useful life (hardware). AND - all through this time (however long that is) - it better be "supported" or else!
My favorites asks are those who expect new firmware - just for the sake of "getting" a new one. Never mind any possibilities of fixing something (anything) - some folks want something new - just to get something new. Most times they have no idea why they want it - they just want it.
Same for software. "I bought Battery 2 in 2006 and I expect it to be available, stable (with full activation) and of course working on any possible hardware/OS combo I decided to buy here in 2024". I mean huh?
Not sure if the "masses" get it or what it is - but tech is fleeting, ever-transitional (AND expensive). If you are getting into the DAW/audio game - you need an ample wallet and a disposition that does not get emotionally attached to anything - like ever.
Because regardless of what you buy (hardware OR software) - there is a 100% guarantee that your "purchase" will eventually be updated, upgraded, changed, altered, cancelled, depreciated and with 1000% certainty - retired (at some point in either the near or distant future)
Some of these levels will test your wallet (upgrades), others will test your patience (altered like KKv3) and some will test your disposition/ability to accept this cycle (retirement) for what it is and carry on.
For me personally - I always remember that no vendor owes me anything. Conversely - no vendor is forcing me to upgrade anything either. I choose when and IF I make a move (AND I accept all that changes that might come with that move) or I stand pat - like using my existing S61 keyboard as is or stay fully committed to a 2014 computer - that still works WITH my existing (activated) copy of Kontakt 5 with zero regret or complaint.
Bottom line - I can either embrace the wonderful tools I have access to - or sit it out on the sidelines and watch. Or get a different - less chaotic/expensive - hobby/vocation/career.
VP
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Only remark: when Nikon put out your camera, they tested it well…and put it out working well.
Oh…and they didn’t told you “buy the camera now, we will make the shutter button work in a couple of years. But at the moment you can already use it as a binocular” 😏
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Hmmm…
When I bought my Maschine+ a few years ago, I got it out of the box, turned it on……and it worked.
I was able to use it for the purpose I intended, and it did what it was supposed to do.
Same with my M32 keyboard. Does what it says on the tin (actually it was a box).
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Right on.
VP
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More importantly when I bought my S88 MK3 keyboard in January I unboxed it, plugged it in. Went through the installation process and it's been working perfectly from day one and I've used it daily. Finished multiple new projects, updated and modified multiple older projects. Maybe the big 'N' logo means "Nikon"????
I'm guessing the one's that are upset with it may have a "W" logo instead of an "N" which stands for "WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!! WAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!"
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"Bottom line - I can either embrace the wonderful tools I have access to - or sit it out on the sidelines and watch. Or get a different - less chaotic/expensive - hobby/vocation/career."
Surprise! Even painting has new technology to keep track of! But no firmware updates as of yet. 😄
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I'm not sure we actually disagree on anything. Or maybe we're just disagreeing on different things?
Bricked MK3s notwithstanding, the shutter button did work on my own MK3. And the MK2 doesn't need a firmware update to still be usable.
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On this, we agree.
On the fact that people having things working properly on their side (not you) seem to be blind that the experience is not the same for many other, a little less 😉
A little bit like a lucky healthy man saying to the one having an heart attack “it’s not possible…my heart is perfectly working”
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In case any of the above few posts are aimed at me, I might have come across poorly in some of my above responses and I apologise.
I never meant to imply NI should do firmware updates, all I meant to say was that they haven’t said they’ve stopped support for the mk2, only the mk1, but if it turned out they had ended support (they haven’t) and I had bought it a week before the mk3 was announced, I would be annoyed.
What I mean to imply by being annoyed is this, say next week Microsoft did an update that stopped the mk2 from working, and I contacted NI and they responded that there’s nothing they can do as it’s no longer supported, having only bought it new at the beginning of September 23, then I would be annoyed and in that situation I think I would be fully justified with my annoyance. Sure MS caused it, but like the problem with the mk3 and USB C on some computers, NI talked to MS and it got sorted.
I’ve made a lot of assumptions there as NI have always been very very helpful whenever I’ve contacted support, and I bet if I contacted them with a mk1 problem, even though they’ve stopped support they would still try to help the best they can.
Also within the UK and Europe, there’s lots of consumer protection anyway.
I never meant to imply I expected random firmware updates or for them to rewrite the software and add a ton of new things. It’s been out for a few years and a simple bit of research before buying it tells the buyer what they are buying, so shouldn’t complain it doesn’t get what the mk3 gets.
I was playing devils advocate in response to a few of the earlier posts which imo implied all support for the mk2 had finished, and I probably shouldn’t have done, again my apologies.
Almost exactly like @DunedinDragon I got my S88 mk3 in January, I did have a couple of problems updating the (required) firmware but my PC is about 10 years old and both NI and this forum got me up and running quickly (I did choose to also do a full reformat and windows 10 install which obviously took a while). Like @DunedinDragon, since that time, my S88 mk3 has also been working 100% perfectly and I’ve used it almost daily and the only reason that word ‘almost’ is there is because there’s been a few days like today (wife’s birthday) when I’ve been kept away from my studio.1
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