Kontrol 2024 outlook: what was, what now, what next?
Comments
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Well, since 2019 there has been no news for the mk2, or did they release a firmware with new functions and I didn't find out? Words are one thing and actions are quite another, you seem like politicians in a campaign when you launch a product, but after you buy it you forget, I regret having invested my money in you and I have a mk2 s88 and another s61.
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"Well, since 2019 there has been no news for the mk2, or did they release a firmware with new functions and I didn't find out?"
What exactly are/were you expecting in terms of "news" for the MK2?
Is there something wrong with your hardware? Is something failing? Or is this just another case of "These guys got new stuff - where's mine?"
Firmware is usually only ever updated to overcome a major functional issue - and as a MKII user here since 2020 - I cannot find a single thing wrong with my S61MKII. I turn it on, I fire up KK v2.9.6 and I record stuff. Then tomorrow I will do it again. That is exactly what it js supposed to do.
Now - if you purchased your MKII device some years ago - coupled with an expectation that NI was going to offer you new features AND new firmware on that device for years afterward - you really should consider adjusting your expectations.
VP
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To be fair there are some areas where there could be further improvements, for example I for one was certainly hoping the ability to manage, import and export MIDI templates was going to be added but it never was.
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Understood. There is (and always will be) something that we all think should be improved - that is a endless wish list. But that does not mean it will.
Q: I still do not understand this "MIDI template" discussion - even at a high level.
I say this knowing full well that I already have everything I could ever want in a "template" with Studio One - with Track Presets. I literally just load and go - never having to interact with anything.
What exactly are they and how would they make my life easier - on the S61MKII?
VP
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I have in the past created MIDI templates for things like controlling Alchemy in Logic - however there is no file management for MIDI templates, you can't save a template as a file to back it up or export to a new computer, so when I moved onto my Mac Studio I was faced with recreating them and so far haven't got round to it. If there were files I could import it would have been easier. Also KK has a nasty habit of periodically forgetting the MIDI templates created, again a backup would have made it easier to recall them.
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This is exactly the wrong kind of response for a community forum. It's designed to make the person feel dumb for posting her comment.
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But this person clearly has no problem making unfounded accusatory comments about product abandonment, name calling (politician?) and imaginary promises ("Words are one thing and actions are quite another" - whose words and what actions?) - all on a product that launched in 2017?
We all knew exactly what we were buying all those years ago (or at least should have) - and any expectations that we would still be getting new firmware or cool features here in 2024 for this specific platform is truly wishful thinking.
If anything - I remain grateful that NI decided to allow us MKII users to join the Komplete Kontrol 3 party at all. That alone shows a willingness to keep the product viable and part of the active community. They could have told us to pack sand.
If the OP feels wronged for not getting the same attention (for a 7 year old product) as the newer model does now - he/she can always step up to the MKIII anytime.
VP
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I know, we already had a related conversation some time ago where we personally exchanged our point of view on that very particular "NI MK2 support" topic. You might be generally right from a helicopter perspective that all products have their natural lifetime, but what you might be missing is that not all people came into the NI universe in 2017 already when the MK2 keyboard has been initially introduced. And according to my personal calculation, the KK MK2 series and their related companion KK2 should at least be natively supported by NI until 2027.
For example, I bought my S61/MK2 one year ago, and that was still before all those dump sales started. Personally, at this time I was not aware that a new NI keyboard was already on its way. No problem, because I know that evolution has to go on. However, what I won't take just like that is that the related Komplete Kontrol V2 software has been retired very soon after that purchase date, namely half a year later, in October 2023, exactly at the time when the MK3 has been introduced. Again, out of the blue and without any comprehensive reason, NI pushed out the new (but obviously unfinished) KK3 application concept, tailored to MK3 only, where half of the MK2-related NKS functionality was suddenly removed, breaking the well-established workflow. Yes, of course anybody can claim that the "old KK2.9.6 application" can still be downloaded from somewhere and used up to this present day. But just for the records: NI officially declared that very KK2 software "unsupported" from that very moment on, meaning that not only MK1 operation has been affected by that move, but also the complete MK2 evolution. No updates and fixes in any way to be expected by customers. Full stop.
Yes, it's correct that NI recently stated that they are aware of the majority of NI customers who are still using MK2 keyboards. But where are their related actions? I can't spot any on NI's side yet, at least maintaining the appearance of trying to minimize the damage they have introduced to that community. There's no activity visible anywhere. They could have started to fix that situation immediately, e.g. by improving KK3 up to a level where it can finally compete again with its predecessor KK2.
Therefore, I can fully understand the frustration of many other NI customers like me, and the statement that words and deads are not matching. If NI would really take care about that big target group of MK2 owners, they would have taken action already, especially by bringing back the abandoned KK functionality into KK3. Considering the support time that NI practiced before, the KK MK2 and its related application should have been fully supported until 2027, but for the sake of the MK3 all MK2 and its application support have been dropped like a hot potato in 2023 already. Instead of letting MK2 owners continue to work as expected, and even benefit from all current feature improvements along the NI evolution path until 2027, they cut off the rope much too soon and decided to focus on the MK3 target group exclusively.
I have been reporting many issues already, describing very basic view and sync functionality between MK2 controls and the KK3 application which won't work anymore in KK3, but as it seems to no avail. No KK3 improvement related to MK2 use cases, and also no MK2 firmware updates anymore. Gee, more than half a year has already passed since KK3 has been introduced and has broken the MK2 workflow completely, and simply nothing has happened since then. And I'm afraid, it will never happen.
I'm not surprised that such a narrow-minded thinking has already started to backfire in the meantime. No one likes to be left behind, especially after having spent a lot of money on NI gear and related software, trusting a leading company in the music business. Please put that very special "customer cap" on for a moment and think about all that; maybe you will realize why some people are currently very upset.
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I’m quite sure in few years, when the new MK3 will still be an half backed, full of unexpressed (and half promised) potentialities keyboard, there will be someone saying “We all knew exactly what we were buying all those years ago (or at least should have) - and any expectations that we would still be getting new firmware or cool features here in 20XX for this specific platform is truly wishful thinking.”
Just hope you will not be the person at which that comment will be directed, just to make you feel dumb for the things you write and the way you feel.
Following your reasoning, every company has the right to release unfinished, untested and full of bugs products, since that was their state when we bought them, so we practically accepted everything
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Have you noticed that in this forum when one tells the truth about Native Instruments' lack of support for past users, others come out to defend this company? Sometimes I think that these users may be employees posing as customers.
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No. It’s just difference of opinions on how we see things.
The only thing I find a pity is that usually “complainers” criticize a company out of interest (seeing something they want implemented, having more…call it as you want), while the “user without any interest attacking other users opinions” is something I will never understand… To me, it just sounds like “look how better than you I am since I clearly (in their point of view) understand things”. The pleasure in proving someone wrong.
Unless they really feel like part of NI and personally attacked if someone criticizes it
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I'm glad you're happy with native instruments, I'm not.
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I’m not happy with NI.
If you read again my post, I was pondering on why some users attack other users, not why users have complaints about the company
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You are right, I apologize.
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Great post - you make some excellent points and I agree with it 100%
"Please put that very special "customer cap" on for a moment and think about all that; maybe you will realize why some people are currently very upset"
To be honest - this user (@Lautaro Tanok) hasn't really even stated "why" he is upset - he just has an air of bitterness for reasons unknown. Maybe if he explained his position in a little more detail - I might have a better idea on what he/she is going through - but it is what it is I guess.
Back to my "customer cap". It is on all day - every day - but I do not see how that makes any difference here. The only (very brief) time we as "customers" are ever right (or at a position of strength) is when we make a decision with our wallets.
As an S61MKII owner - I am (and always have been) at peace with the fact that my board - even with it's poor implemented KK3 support (as of now) - was at end of the life when I bought it.
Did that stop me from enjoying it? Did I come in here in October 2020 - weeks after I bought my (already three year old) keyboard and start railing on NI with my hand out demanding to know where my firmware updates were and what new features that I (as a then new customer) expected to get?
No - I used the board , enjoyed the board - and continue to enjoy it. I knew (even then) that the day would come where this thing - like every other thing I buy - would be end of life, un-updatable and another decision would eventually need to be made.
Am I upset that KK3 is the sad, feature cut step brother of KK2 and it remains unusable in my workflow - YES. Do I feel the need to bang my chest (with my customer cap on) and come in and rant on about how I have been wronged because my keyboard finally aged out after 7+ years? No. Do I blame NI for all this? No.
If I am going to blame anyone - I should blame myself. I made the decision to buy an S61MKII - three years into an existing cycle. I laid down the money and I took my chances (with plenty of visions in my head) of a exciting feature filled hardware cycle full of cool software releases and awesome firmware updates. None of which came to pass.
Right or wrong (and a hard reality that many in here refuse to accept) - once you commit to a company (and whatever their product) - you are now at the mercy of their plans and can really take off your customer cap. Some companies help you out and DO deliver cool stuff and others do not. You can either live with your decision or do not buy in the first place. But there are no in-betweens.
"You might be generally right from a helicopter perspective that all products have their natural lifetime,
Natural lifetime is an inevitable constant and occurs for all products.
"What you might be missing is that not all people came into the NI universe in 2017 already when the MK2 keyboard has been initially introduced. "
Not missing it at all - I am a prime example of someone who showed up 3 years late to the party. And I hope - explained my mindset above.
Like Lautaro - maybe I should be more upset at NI - but I simply do not see the point. I am already in deep with the product line an have work to do. I would rather focus my energy there instead of burning it this way
And according to my personal calculation, the KK MK2 series and their related companion KK2 should at least be natively supported by NI until 2027.
Where do we see this "not" being the reality right now? The board IS fully supported and works with KK3. NI has already stated that KK v2.9.6 will be available for users for the foreseeable feature.
Unless you are misconstruing "support" to mean - new features. Which are two radically different cycles.
VP
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