S88 MK3 & Maschine Integration

MoorishJedi619
MoorishJedi619 Member Posts: 4 Member

Are there any plans whatsoever to bring back Maschine Integration? I'm asking because I'm a LONG time Maschine user who literally just invested into the S88 MK3, assuming it would be fully compatible with Maschine, only to find out that the integration is gone and it seems as if Native Instruments just doesn't care about it/those of us who either enjoyed the integration or those of us who wanted to enjoy said integration... C'mon now NI.... ya'll dropped the ball on this one 😞

Comments

  • Maciej Repetowski
    Maciej Repetowski Member Posts: 369 Pro

    NI has repeatedly said that this is not planned at all, unfortunately.

  • Vic Angelo
    Vic Angelo Member Posts: 104 Advisor

    Unfortunately, They don't understand the amazing Hardware Combo that was Maschine and Kontrol mk2. They don't realize how many more people wanted the integration. Kontrol MK3 is nearly useless to Maschine users at this point. Best Options for you are

    1.) "Downgrade" back to Kontrol MK2 for the true potential of Maschine.

    2.) Get an MPC Key 61 or 37 and ditch NI altogether.

    3.) Get any other MIDI keyboard on the market because without Customizable MIDI templates Kontrol MK3, literally Any other MIDI Keyboard would be better.

  • Tamicheal
    Tamicheal Member Posts: 3 Newcomer

    As a long time NI user I can relate. I recently purchased the s88 mk3 but was quick to find out it is not integrated as models in the past. Cmon NI. Please make this right. Is there anything in the works to make KK MK3 integrated with Maschine?

  • MoorishJedi619
    MoorishJedi619 Member Posts: 4 Member

    Is there no one that we could talk to about this?? A Petition we could start or something? I want the new product(s) for sure but I NEED the integration and unfortunately there's seemingly nowhere to downgrade the MK3 to a MK2 😞

  • MoorishJedi619
    MoorishJedi619 Member Posts: 4 Member

    Is there anyone we can contact about this? I'm not aware of NI declaring that they will never make it fully integrated with Maschine or whatever but I could definitely be wrong. I just don't understand how it is that NI could do us like this? 😞😞😞 I'm very disappointed

  • Maciej Repetowski
    Maciej Repetowski Member Posts: 369 Pro
    edited January 25

    They basically said that the percentage of users using this integration with Mk2 keyboards was so low that it didn’t make sense for them financially to implement this functionality with Mk3 series. I, as many others, consider it a wrong decision, but that’s about it.

    Another wrong decision (IMHO) was to release Mk3 series without onboard midi template editing or play assist functions. The keyboard was released in unfinished state and we have yet to see any progress on adding those functions (NI estimated this to be delivered in Q1 2024, here we are nearly in February already).

    Wanna bet this will shift to Q3 or Q4?

  • Matthew_NI
    Matthew_NI Product Team Posts: 694 mod

    As has been stated: we were very proud of the integration Maschine and the Kontrol S MK2 had. It was a significant effort to build and maintain, but unfortunately bore little fruit.

    A very small % of users owned both products, and a smaller % of that group used the integration. Of course, this does nothing to appease the people who do use it, and want it for MK3. But, that's why.

    If ever there's an integration brought back, it would be rather basic (e.g. Transport controls) as there's no evidence to suggest the high effort implementation was, and/or would be worth it.

  • Matthew_NI
    Matthew_NI Product Team Posts: 694 mod

    I don't think it's so binary as a decision being right or wrong, although I understand why you'd feel that way. The prioritization results in a variety of feelings across a spectrum, but my hope is the reasons why it was made are at least understood, even if they're not universally liked.

    With regards to MIDI template editing, it looks like we'll be in beta in March, rather than public release in March, so slightly longer than anticipated as the team is temporarily down a few members.

  • Maciej Repetowski
    Maciej Repetowski Member Posts: 369 Pro

    @Matthew_NI The reasons are understood, sure. I might not like it and few others, but I'll live πŸ˜‹

    On a positive note, I really like the look and feel of MK3 (I had a go with it in local PMT music store, here in Norwich), keyboard is amazing and screen is beautiful. Can you confirm that Midi template editing will be available on device and not only in KK, like it was with Mk2?

    And another question, any plans to provide CC midi events for transport and other buttons while in 100% midi mode (when not connected to computer at all), to use with external hardware sequencers and such?

    I have Novation Launchkey Mk3 here plugged via Midi (not USB, I didn't like Logic integration provided by Novation) and it generates midi events from nearly all buttons - so I can learn/assign my own midi functions in Logic?

  • Matthew_NI
    Matthew_NI Product Team Posts: 694 mod

    I can confirm it will be on-device only. But there will also be another update that allows templates to be transferred between devices/systems, so you're not locked into one device.

    Also, for the DAW control buttons, no. But it's good feedback!

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia Member Posts: 3,489 Expert
    edited January 26

    Speaking for myself I never really took to the Maschine integration for one simple reason, it was incomplete without Maschine actually supporting the aftertouch my S Series MkII could produce, which meant Maschine in turn could also not fully support the software instruments I love most that all support a greater range of expression - not just aftertouch but also things like MPE, that Maschine just wasn't up to handling. Even NI's flagship synth, Massive X, doesn't sound as it is intended to sound in Maschine, so many patches rely on aftertouch it feels like a much more limited synth than it really is when run inside Maschine. I think people need to face the fact that there never was really great integration between Maschine and MkII keyboards, at least not if you actually wanted to use the keyboard fully within Maschine.

    It's such a pity really, a missed opportunity even. I would have loved to be able to record tracks created on my MkII keyboard directly into Maschine, it would have been perfect for that were it not for that one limitation, and NI's blind spot when it came to even acknowledging it, let alone doing anything about it.

  • MoorishJedi619
    MoorishJedi619 Member Posts: 4 Member
    edited January 27

    Thank you for responding!!! I definitely appreciate your candor as well. While I am extremely disheartened by the decision you all decided to make (even though I don't know where you all are getting your figures from to base these decisions off of...[lol not sales of course but just in general for those users who DID own both products]) I guess I can understand the logic/reasoning to essentially not do as much work on the product(s) if you felt it had no effect. I just believe that you all were on the cutting edge of production when it came to your vision of combining a drum machine and a keyboard, their full integration, the workflow, etc... lol tbh, that's what some of your competitors are also trying to accomplish as well (even though theirs may be a keyboard/drum machine all in one and it is standalone) but to me, going in the direction where you all were going made more monetary sense. You could sell more products/hardware, you already have a standalone drum machine, you could integrate both products (Maschine and Kontrol Keyboard) with 3rd party plugins, you already have a MASSIVE library of effect plugins/sounds that you could also sell to incorporate with both products, etc... the list goes on and on... To me, having everything work together (think Apple) should be the goal of anyone in the technology space because that only lends itself to a more user friendly environment which could in turn, convert into more sales. I get it, that it "bore little fruit" but that's very short sighted in my opinion. Instead of looking at all of the room you all have to make gains/strides in the industry, you admittedly took the easier route and agreed to essentially do less work just because it didn't "sell the way that you believed it should have," etc... That should have been looked at as an opportunity to improve your marketing, your public relations (again, I have zero idea where you all got your numbers from), your promotion, etc... You all could have ran more deals, created incentives for users to buy both products... lol but no, you were like "it didn't make us enough money...so instead of us doing more work to allow it to make us more money, lets punish the users who DID enjoy that feature, etc..." As someone who in my personal life has ALWAYS went to bat for you, always defended/promoted Native Instruments (Its integration being one of the key components), this most recent executive decision has definitely had an effect on my view of NI as a company and your approach to how you apparently view/value your customers, their feedback, etc... (SN: since you all took the stance of "the percentage of users..." I would be very interested in hearing how many customers or "the percentage" that have actually been happy/excited to see that you all took the integration away... like, who all is celebrating that you removed the Maschine integration...was it the customers/users or was it the development team?? πŸ€”πŸ€”πŸ€”) On the contrary, I'm pretty sure you've all been receiving more negative comments about removing the integration than positive ones... just my opinion though πŸ™πŸΎ

    Again, love your products and I'm ALL IN on the Maschine and the Kontrol Keyboard but you all dropped the ball on this one....and instead of looking in the mirror, at yourselves and trying to figure out why it wasn't producing the "bottom line" that you all covet so dearly... you punished us...your customers. 😞

  • nightjar
    nightjar Member Posts: 1,239 Guru

    Not pleased that it's planned as on-device only.

    The limitations of the on-device screen and on-device navigation will make MIDI template editing more difficult and a less enjoyable experience.

  • FinalFrontier
    FinalFrontier Member Posts: 6 Member

    I am one of those rare users who has a KK S61 MK1 (yes, ONE) and a Maschine Studio and uses Maschine for recording. So if I upgrade Maschine software, my keyboard stops working. If I upgrade Komplete Kontrol software, my keyboard stops working, and even if I get a new MK3, my keyboard stops working in Maschine. I happen to like the workflow I had in Maschine. Was it perfect (could you have different sounds selected on Maschine and Kontrol? for example), no, but it worked for me.

    So, basically I have to start over. I did buy Maschine + early on, and so far that has been a disappointment in what I can use with it in standalone mode and right now I am back to using my Maschine Studio while I debate whether to sell the Maschine+ and move on, yet some samples I purchased from 8Dio required an upgrade to Kontakt 7, and upgrading to Komplete 14 Ultimate wasn't much more. I know I can use the sounds within a DAW (just using them in Komplete Kontrol seems dumb - am I missing something? It doesn't even go full screen and if I try to view full window on certain modules, I have to scroll). It is just a glorified sound picker, which I suppose I won't need with the screens on the new keyboard. To get full use of the light guides, etc., do I have to use it? I don't even remember. Like I said - I'm starting over and will have to go and dig through the manuals like a new user. I'm not very happy.

    Not integrating your products together almost makes no sense to me, especially since there seems to be ways you could integrate them even better than you have in the past.

    I'm in the market for a controller with Polyphonic Aftertouch, but I really need to understand how I need to set this up to get full use of it which right now isn't very clear to me. I also need to understand how well the MK3 will work with other software/hardware as in the past these were clunky implementations.

    As a long time user of Native Instruments products I feel a bit abandoned.

  • Vic Angelo
    Vic Angelo Member Posts: 104 Advisor
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