Is it possible to use Maschine MK3 and Maschine Jam Stripe to Scratch like a DJ?

Murat Kayi

Which example do you mean @D-One ? Because I actually really like the sound of what Blue Lab Beats do...

Jiglo

I think it's acceptable in the first video and better than a lot of real scratching on some of my favourite old school tracks, but standards these days are getting higher with more and more people having serious skills, including young kids, but it's changing a lot too and one day I can see some DJ get nearly there on a more studio based controller. There's still a lot of bad scratching making it's way into music though and that is far from the worst sounding.

I do agree that it isn't competition level, like the kid has. I'm a purely vinyl DJ and love the artform. I used to travel between Europe and North America watching DMC events and even traveled with DMC to some events through the mid 90s to 00 and still watch the occasional heat. I've had a few private 1 on 1 lessons with a World Champ who lives fairly locally too. Not saying my opinion is more worthy, or I can scratch better than anyone else, but just that I love people pushing the barriers of what is achievable and although i'll always prefer a vinyl routine, I can applaud people pushing these production controllers.

jcp_13

@D-One Thank you, I have a lot to learn!

tetsuneko

Oh man, that 10-year old would kick my butt LMAO

Nice to see the next generation still cutting without DVS

Jiglo

I reckon a large percentage of Qberts scratching is off beat. I've seen near full performances where he's barely on beat and yet he's lauded as one of the greatest turntablists ever, so if it has to be clinical, then i'll let you break it to him.

But turntablism is an expression. It's jazz, it's freestyle, it can be loose, it can be tight as it's art and a lot of people don't understand it.

But, we're talking about a 1 take routine here on a Maschine, not turntables and we should take that into context of the performance. It wouldn't be fair to put it up against a turntablist routine because it isn't a level playing field. And that controller performance is the bar that others have to beat.

Also watch some of Blue Lab's videos. The man can play 16ths live. The Maschine player would probably have been a top turntablist if he'd pursued that as he has amazing control of his digits.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sO_Nhl95CxM

Jiglo

Yes, he's a don of turntablism and I don't want to take away from his legacy. He's someone I respect a lot, even though I don't agree with all his politics these days. i'll correct myself and say not a large percentage, I was wrong to throw that it, but a few of his most recent showcases that people have shared on facebook over recent years. throwing technical scratches over a fast beat and losing timekeeping sounding discordant is very hard for me to listen to, much like thrash metal guitars and drums getting far out of sync and off the beat.

LostInFoundation

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/118253#Comment_118253

You named the right guy. When Dilla started making his off grids, many called them “wrong”. Only after people started getting used to it and saw the genius behind it.

Or… when Gil Scott-Heron started to enounce his poetry on music, often without caring too much of the “common sense” of metric, many said he was untalented or he just had to go back to only writing

Many genres were “off grid” to what people were used to (cumbia, to name one) and therefore were pointed as “strange” (in the best case). But then they started to be comprehended. Or at least “less strange”

Even big artists sometimes do something that is not so familiar with the mass ears…it could even sound “late” or “badly performed”…isn’t that enriching?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3QS83ubhHE

And…specially in Jazz (Blue Lab Beats are without any doubt part of this category, even if they do it with a twist of modernity)…the whole concept of “on beat” has less sense than in any other genre: it’s all about the feel. Some do feel it, some not.

Same is valid even for “normal” taste (without even the need for off grid or anything out of what is considered “usual”): for some metal guitar soloists are pure geniuses in action, for others they are just guitar necks masturbators 😂

Murat Kayi

As concerns Blue Lab Beats I remember a video when Komplete 13 came out where it was just Maschine and a number of vintage keys patches and a number of people were complaining about the hihats being off or the groove being shaky and were deriding the fingerdrumming chops whereas I thought it was groovy af and reminded me a lot of what Dilla has been doing. And yet we're listening to the same music in that video, goes to show it's highly subjective.

Anyway, what I was on about with above video is that it's a great ressource of encouragement for anyone interested in the question of how far you can get with Maschine controller for scratching. Does that compete with what lovers of the art form know from their coveted Master DJs? No. Would 19 out 20 average non musicians in the street actually notice any difference, though? No. (imo)

PK The DJ

There's some crazy "off grid" stuff in this playlist:-

https://novationmusic.com/articles/our-favourite-offgrid-beats/

LostInFoundation

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/118649#Comment_118649

That’s a nice playlist indeed. Well…every playlist including Meshell Ndegeocello and Yussef Dayes and putting So Far To Go on top as the icing on the cake can’t be a bad one.

This one had the merit to make me discover some tubes in genres I probably wouldn’t have searched for but that are more than valid.

Thank you

D-One

Again... I love off grid beats, im a 90's kid and grew up on Dilla amongst others, since it seems what I'm saying is not being understood at all, I'll remove my comments and myself from this conversation. Perhaps scratch is really difficult to understand for a non-scratch DJ. I don't want to antagonize anyone or be perceived as hating on any artist, especially good ones as my social footprint online matters a lot to me. Y'all carry on discussing this topic amongst yourselfs... peace and love! ✌️

LostInFoundation

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/118678#Comment_118678

No need to remove anything or leave. It’s just a discussion ☺️

I think we understood you (at least I did, and I don’t think it’s because I have been a Dj and scratched for 20 years…what you said is more than clear👍🏼).

We just wanted to point out that even a not perfect scratch (and you are right on saying it was not perfect) can be interesting or even done expressly (like a note played too late or too soon)

Jiglo

I also understand what you're saying and agree with most of it and you also corrected me when I stepped out of line. That was the right thing to do.

In some ways this topic reminds me of the Serato forum in it's heyday from Scratch Live, through the blip that was Itch, to the early days of DJ Pro when opinions varied widely on what is acceptable regarding new features and what isn't as djing was changing rapidly. It was a hot touchy topic of the old guard wanting to stay true to the roots (but still wanting dvs) and the new generation that embraced the new features. Even some beefs were started and one guy whom most thought probably couldn't scratch, because he didn't ever rise to the bate when challenged, eventually posted a routine video that went viral and was probably the greatest day on the internet.

Anyway, I digress. But yes, it's just a discussion. Maybe i'm a bit too close to this too as I used to live and breathe it and do sometimes say some daft things in the heat of the moment as my memories aren't always as fresh as they were. I do respect your broad musical knowledge too.

Murat Kayi

I also think I understood you. You're passionate about it and we just weren't on the same page. It surely isn't necessary to agree on everything for a discussion to be fruitful!

D-One

I am not upset guys :) I just don't want anything that can be interpreted as negative towards others to have my name attached online.

What I meant really has nothing to do with off-grid, swing, drunk-drummer style either by Dilla or QuestLove, resistance to new tech like DVS, Sync, Controllers, etc... people can scratch on iPhone for all I care, if it sounds good it sounds good, I don't look down on any of that, quite the opposite but if that keeps coming up it's because what I tried to convey is not coming across, might be my fault for failing to explain it correctly, so I rather just bounce off the convo as I am derailing this.