Has anyone a solution for restoring KK presets after updates

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JOHN IE
JOHN IE Member Posts: 5 Newcomer
edited October 2023 in Komplete Kontrol

as above.... lost all my presets after the KK update in a album session im doing..... i tried rolling back the updates but all the KK presets have disappeared......

would really appreciate any help as my integrety as a producer and a label deadline are at risk,

Thanks in Advance

Best Answer

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,741 Expert
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    Obviously NI have not even tested this, to make sure people will not loose their dat, which is a shame!

    They know, the issue is it is not NIs responsibility (really) to educate people on the VST2/3 mess that Steinberg created.

    I really need to make a video on this topic because I have explained it probably over a hundred times and it has been coming for at least 2 years...

    KK wont install itself on your system without you specifically installing it so likely you never uninstalled it or didn't do it correctly, the old VST3 plugin is still on your system somewhere. Check the Common\VST3 folder in Program Files, delete the VST3 plugin manually then install V2.9 of KK (not 2.8) again making sure to install BOTH the VST2 and VST3 plugins, and of course that the VST2 plugin is installing to the correct location to be scanned into your DAW

    VST2 is EOL, it is no longer supported, hasn't been for over a year now. Most DAWs still support VST2 but new releases like KKV3 do not offer VST2 support anymore (there is no VST2 version) and due to the fact it is a plugin host itself, I am not sure it can even offer migration where it may possibly work.

    So the issue will be if you are not educated on what VST2/3 means, you will find that when you install KK V3, ALL your past projects that had KK hosting your plugins in the VST2 wrapper will now fail to load the plugins because there is no VST2 version of KK anymore.

    The Solution

    First, do your backups on your whole system before updating KK at all.

    Next, you need to open ALL your projects where KK was used, locate every instance and then not just replace the VST2 version of KK on the track with VST3 but also load the VST3 version of the plugin that was hosted in KK at the same time.

    Best way to do this is to open the KK instance then in the plugin itself, export the patch you use somewhere. Delete the KK plugin on that track, load the VST3 version then load the VST3 version of the plugin back and then reload your patch into the plugin.

    Now, when swapping out the loaded plugin I would suggest you reload the new version using an NKS patch for the VST3 version. If you know what patch was used (take note before deleting the instance) you can simply reload that NKS patch. This will make sure the same controls in the NKS preset have been loaded which will be important if you have some automation recorded that you need to have working, or you will need to manually fix all that up too.

    Once you understand the process and have a track updated it will be much easier.

    TEST

    This is up to personal preference but at the moment I would suggest to not update to V3 of KK for a few reasons but if you have to because you have an MK3 or you just don't value sanity all that much, before updating to V3 where you cannot fix these issues, TEST your updated projects to make sure they are now all VST3 compatible. Just locate the VST2 version of the KK plugin and remove it from your plugin folder and attempt to load your project. If the KK plugin is missing completely on a track, you likely did not update that one to VST3.

    It will take time, patience and in some cases you will have to redo some work but even plugins outside of KK need this done in many cases since the VST3 version will not work in place of VST2 automatically and has to be manually swapped out. Again, this is a bit of a failure on Steinberg for making this a difficult thing for devs to understand but also devs for not really caring enough to invest the time. Some plugins work perfectly like most of NI plugins and UVI so it is certainly possible.

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Answers

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,741 Expert
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    First advice, never do ANY update when working on projects without a decent backup solution.

    Likely, you need to simply open KK and let it scan depending on how large your preset library is it could take some time to scan and populate but likely, you will want to revert back to 2.9 given some of the issues in the latest version being reported

  • JOHN IE
    JOHN IE Member Posts: 5 Newcomer
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    Thanks JesterMgee, believe me I'm aware of dangers of updating during projects but i guess i clearly didn't see the the KK update amongst all the other plugin updates when i ran Native Access app the last morning, as you suggested i did roll back the KK version to 2.9 but to no avail.. i went through the whole process that NI suggest to be done when uninstalling kk deleting local app files etc but I'm absolutely baffled as to how they let the 3.0 update go through without proper due diligence.. i went back through all my 4 year sessions and every single preset has been wiped.. granted those projects have been delivered to the client but as i said in the post its the current project that has my reputation on the line as a producer, if there's anything at all that you can help with i would be so grateful.

    Thanks for reaching out i really do appreciate it,

    I've been looking at the posts about this and NI have fallen short on this in a major way

  • jef
    jef Member Posts: 23 Member
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    Hey John! If you mean your projects load up with empty Komplete instances... I had the same problem (in Cubase) and found that I had to get KK running in an empty project, then perform the scan from within Cubase, that seemed to fix things for me. (scanning standalone didn't do anything). Worth a try! (Actually... that was last week on 2.9.x Hopefully this applies for V3)

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,741 Expert
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    Just out of curiosity, are you saying all your factory presets for all NI instruments are also missing? I know KKv3 uses a new db file so when you install it and run for the first time it needs to rescan all your VST then rescan all NKS files. I dont have V3 installed at the moment but in my testing, it appeared to at least scan all my NKS files which I have in a custom factory entry and all my other instruments appeared to also display tho I did not pick thru them.

    I am guessing you are on mac so not too sure what to check there but first I would look in the preferences - Library tab and see if the locations are listed for the libraries or if the thing is empty.

  • JOHN IE
    JOHN IE Member Posts: 5 Newcomer
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    Hi Jef, thanks for the feedback, yes the KK instances are gone (plugin not found etc) the midi arrangements are still there but without the kk instance also the automation has gone so I'm just left with a blank midi channel, im in Ableton 11 but i tried what you suggested and to no avail.... im gonna try to upgrade again to kk 3 but i don't hold out much hope... any other suggestions?

    Thanks

  • Thusis
    Thusis Member Posts: 15 Newcomer
    edited October 2023
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    You use Mac or Windows? In Mac Komplete Kontrol User Presets are located in Documents/Native Instruments/User Content.

    The presets should be phisically there, doesnt make anysense that Komplete Kontrol Software deletes them with a scan. You can check if the presets are there. I would recommend to revert back to 2.9.4 or 2.9.6 and rescan the DB.

    Therefor go to User Library/Application Support/Native Instruments/Komplete Kontrol. In there you can delete all files but not the folder! There should be files like komplete.db3. This will completely rescan your Factory and User Preset Base as the Plugin Base. After deleting the files in this folder open Komplete Kontrol in Standalone mode and wait. It will rescan now and this will take some time depending on how much plugins and presets you have.

    If you are not familiar how to open the Mac User Library you can search for it in the internet.

    If you are on Windows someone else here needs to support you to point to the right folders.

    If this doesnt solve your issue you habe another problem and lost your preset folders which i highly doubt.

    Good Luck 🍀

  • Thusis
    Thusis Member Posts: 15 Newcomer
    edited October 2023
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    And this is important as well as Jester stated. Check if in Komplete Kontrol Prefernces under Library in Factory and Users Folder Paths are there. But here as well would be strange if the Software would erase that because these are .plist files as far as i knowwhich will not be touched with the installation process of Komplete Kontrol

  • JOHN IE
    JOHN IE Member Posts: 5 Newcomer
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    I'm a widows guy, Windows 10 PRO Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-8700 CPU @ 3.20GHz  3.19 GHz

    Like you say i may need windows peeps to chime in with regard folder locations etc,

    I have rolled back to KK 2.9.4 but still the same result... the thing is all my presets are there and there's no issue recalling them (even the ones from years ago) but its the session instances that just disappeared along with the automation that was written along with the ques (for every session for 4 years that had KK on the session) I'm using mainly Spitfire strings and brass so all the inputs for said instruments are just gone, the midi notes are still there but just not the instruments i played the sections on and there's 20+ channels,

    The session was ongoing and with the usual client chopping and changing buzz so I'm kind of against the wall as to explaining why I'm late with the latest arr.

    Thanks for everything Thusis i really do appreciate the feedback.... its nice to know thers help out there, if anything comes to mind let me know 😉

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 4,057 mod
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    Sounds like you need to rescan plugins in KK then rescan the database. Your presets are still there but the new KK has a different database so needs to build that first

  • myalteredsoul
    myalteredsoul Member Posts: 211 Advisor
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    I had this happen to me as well. Both my custom now libraries and presets were cleared when updating to kk 3.0 via native access. Luckily I had em backed up (also rolled back to 2.9 now due to multiple plugin UI’s from now partners not loading in kk 3.0). I could see this being a nightmare for anyone who doesn’t have em backed up, though.

  • MattyMusic
    MattyMusic Member Posts: 1 Newcomer
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    Can I ask did anyone here find a solution for this? I just updated to KK3 for my new job, but some freelance jobs I have ongoing are using KK2. I just loaded up Pro Tools tonight to finish off one such project, to find none of the instruments playing - all instances in KK have been deleted. Desperate to find a fix for this, thanks.
  • JOHN IE
    JOHN IE Member Posts: 5 Newcomer
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    > @MattyMusic said:
    > Can I ask did anyone here find a solution for this? I just updated to KK3 for my new job, but some freelance jobs I have ongoing are using KK2. I just loaded up Pro Tools tonight to finish off one such project, to find none of the instruments playing - all instances in KK have been deleted. Desperate to find a fix for this, thanks.

    I hear ya mate........ still no solution for this.... and zero help from NI on this
  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 1,330 Guru
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    The two versions of Komplete Kontrol are not designed to co-exist.

    And unless you actually have one of the new Mark III keyboards - KK3 is a waste of time and is unnecessary - espeically for MKII boards.

    For anyone using the MKI or MKII series - Komplete Kontrol v2.9.6 is the way.

    VP

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,741 Expert
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    Yep, basically this. The V3 software should only be installed at the moment if you own an MK3 keyboard. It seemingly offers more loss in function than any real benefit other than a resizable browser which is welcomed, but sadly the browser itself is now crippled for several reasons vocalised by users on the forums.

    There is actually a tech note from NI on how to install BOTH V2 and V9 together:

    https://support.native-instruments.com/hc/en-us/articles/14394517675677-How-to-Keep-Komplete-Kontrol-2-9-and-Komplete-Kontrol-3-on-Your-System

    A big issue is the fact the V3 software doesn't support VST2 so ALL projects you ever had that used VST2 plugins will likely break since VST2 doesn't migrate up to VST3 for 90% of plugins. Some plugin devs were smart enough to actually incorporate the migration, most either have no idea or don't care. Devs are not to fully blame tho, the VST standards are a bit convoluted.

    So you need to stick with 2.9, make sure it has the paths to BOTH your VST2 and VST3 plugins and load projects that have VST2 plugins then swap these with the VST3 version in KK. Best to wrap your head around it all because that has to be done for every project you ever made that you need to open moving forward as VST2 will eventually be unsupported by most DAWs eventually too.

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 4,057 mod
    edited February 20
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    A big issue is the fact the V3 software doesn't support VST2

    It does support VST2 plugins - it just doesn't come as a VST2

    Obviously people do need to add paths to the VST3 and VST2 folders in KK3 for it to work

    On Mx Macs for VST2 plugins to load KK also needs to be run in Rosetta but that is also true for KK 2.9.6

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