Komplete Kontrol S series MK1 keyboards End Of Life
Comments
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The risk of issuing vouchers would be the perception that this decision was a money-grab designed to force users to upgrade, as opposed to a decision made with particular legacy libraries and frameworks that are no longer compatible with or supported by new features we're introducing or wish to build (ironically, by popular demand).
I do not say whether NI should or not issue vouchers or whatever...
I jus want to share my experience of vaguely similar case.
Eventide, company that makes hardware and SW for musicians has decided to stop selling their pedals H9 Core and H9. They went on selling H9 Max. And at the same time they put down the possibility to buy algorithms (plugins) for H9 Core and H9. H9 Max has all of them. And at the same time still left possibility to update H9 Core/H9 to H9 Max (in fact buy all missing agorithms). And decided not to add any algorithms to H9 Max. It was not EOL as they were still selling H9 Max for few more years.... But it was end of device development.
To make bitter pill for customers less bitter each user of pedal could receive bundle of plugins worth 500 USD. Which was really, really greatly generous. That bundle was NFR, but could be used as base for future upgrades of Eventide plugin Bundles....
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It will be time for users to evaluate their best way forward to ensure a MK1 and KK 2.9.4 remain in static (non-updateable) environment to continue to get full value.
But, beside MK1, I have also Maschine Studio, Maschine MK3 and Maschine Jam. So, I will have to stay on current Maschine SW, or use KK Sxx MK1 in MIDI mode (that is without light guide, which is why I have NI kb...)
I have spent about 5 000 EUR on NI HW, maybe even more. And few more thousands on SW.
My solution of the situation is not to buy any more NI HW. I may buy any dull MIDI keyboard and get the same user experionce over the long time range.
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With regards to data tracking - the issue is more ensuring an accurate and reliable enough sample size.
Approximately 90% of our customers share anonymized usage data with us, so it's reasonably well reflective of the user-base.
It may may be reasonably well reflective for some cases, and pretty biased for other cases. Mainly those marginal. I do not say, it is biased, I do not know, but one would have to check, before saying it is representative.
In this case for example to check if there is similar percentage of KK Sxx MK1 registered in the both groups (sharing data and not sharing data).
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I hope the Mk1 will remain in Controller Editor so custom MIDI templates can still be created and edited.
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I may have missed something, but if this decision was not only for money grab, kill a device that works perfectly fine, invoking the "10 years old, old tech, too complicated to maintain both worlds, understand us"
Could someone explain me why A25 ( around 2018 ) , A49 ( 2018 ), M32 (around 2019), A61 ( 2018 )....
Are NOT discontinued ?
same tech, so you'll have to maintain versions for them, no ?
the complication must come from the little led lights and the after touch, that are COMPLETELY different.
Sorry NI, but that pill is hard to swallow....
thousands in hardware and software to a chosen company and now this...
I'm sorry but When I place thousands on a guitar, I don't have to put it into the trashbin because you want money, All the expression pedals will work for ever on every hardware, every piece of gear, etc....
Now you are sending the proper signal:
Future users, do you want to RENT for thousands, because it's not a one shot purchase....
I was looking for buying more NI stuff, upgrade soft$, gera etc.... I even upgraded to the big Ultimate thing... BECAUSE I had mey KEYBOARD ALREADY, that is the reason why I stayed, because I took into account that I had this already, well done, planned well.
But clearly this was a move that absolutely throws something that stinks over the NI Sphere for me.
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"Cool, the MK3 is out, I'm going to grab a 49 so that I'm more mobile, and that'll fit perfectly my S61 MK1 in the room".
NI : nooooo, we won't let you, you have to buy TWO NEW keyboards. because we won't let you use them both
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I just can’t understand the infantile reactions of many to this announcement. NI have made a perfectly reasonable commercial decision as all businesses do, have handled it professionally and to read some of these posts NI are murdering babies in their cradles.
Just for comparison Mac OS Catalina released in October 2019 is no longer supported and in fact reached end of life in September 2022.
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An announcement like this is always disappointing, as owners of the affected products, or owners of newer NI hardware that now worry 'is my product next on the EOL list and how long have I got left?'.
That said, having members of the NI team directly engaging with the community on here to discuss the decision is really positive though, even when it is bad news!
Lots of good points being made on here and I would just echo what others have said multiple times already; stopping any further development on KK, that supports MK1 keyboards, is unfortunate but understandable for the age of the product, but being able to have the last working version of KK compatible with future Mac OS (we all know this is probably the main culprit) would appease quite a lot of the community (I think, anyway) until they decide to update to MK3 etc.
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Yes - it does blow my mind how some folks are 100% bitter and miserable about a keyboard that had a decade long support window - yet say nothing about MacOS or their way overpriced Apple hardware.
These buyers are completely complicit and bent over hard by Apple and have no issue whatsoever in dropping 2 or 3K on a new M2 machine knowing full well it will be the most expensive paperweight ever in 3-5 short years. And then because it's Apple - they do it all over again.
VP
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While I somewhat disagree with your take on Apple's OSs and hardware, considering the communication and support that Apple gives to their customers, the main reason for my earlier comments were to have a constructive conversation about solutions to the, now released KK 3.0, incompatibilities between S Series mk1s and the rest of the NI stack. I applaud @Matthew_NI and the entire NI team for their continued support of these efforts and the productive discussions we've had in this thread. While my studio / training facility will need to make some tough decisions soon regarding these changes and potential other upcoming NI EOL announcements (both hardware and software), we do understand the need for NI to maintain a stable ecosystem with the products they continue to support.
Let's all just step back and not take this issue so personally.
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I agree, overall with your statement (as I've used the reference to Apple (iPhone evolution) as an example), however I disagree with the "3-5 year M2 Mac paperweight" reference. I've been using the Mac platform since 1992 for music production and my mid-2011 Mac mini served me for 9 years in that arena before I upgraded to a 2020 M1 Mac mini (now 3 years old and still working perfectly fine in studio, on Catalina), and just purchased an M2 Mac Studio for the same purchase. I plan to get at least 9 years out of the latter - it all depends on your use case. My iPhone 12 mini, purchased new, is also serving me fine. That said, NI is doing nothing different than Apple, Microsoft, or any major tech company who advances their products. Ceasing to invest another penny in NI products is a personal choice, but it won't stop the process people are wailing over....all these reactions make zero sense to me too.
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A series and M32 were released after the S series MK2, so they share more technology than with the MK1.
The keyboard will still work with Komplete Kontrol 2.9.4 on Windows 10 and 11, on MacOS 10.15, 11, 12 and 13, that means a few more years on Mac if you don't rush to upgrade the OS, and even after that it can still be used as a standard MIDI keyboard.
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macOS was most recently a culprit with Apple Silicon, hence the decision to ensure all users were brought along for the necessary Apple Silicon updates.
Approximately 50% of our users are on macOS, of which the Apple Silicon share increases monthly.
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Indeed - there are many checks and balances when it comes to how data is used and interpreted here.
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I think the concern is reasonable and valid.
Worth pointing out that this decision was made due to certain technological frameworks specific to Kontrol S MK1 that are no longer supported or compatible with new features being introduced. Meaning, it should not necessary follow that because Kontrol S MK1 was EOL'd after almost a decade, that all subsequent hardware also has a ticking clock of ten years.
To continue to support KK 2.9 on future versions of macOS would be the antithesis of why the decision was made: it would necessitate keeping those frameworks around, which in some cases isn't possible and in other cases would double the work (we'd become less efficient at a time we hope to be more efficient and responsive in our update cadence).
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