Please make all UIs scalable

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  • ProfessorChaos
    ProfessorChaos Member Posts: 138 Advisor
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    Nobody is asking them to rewrite all the old plugins, just change the code so the OS can show them at a normal size. The other day I installed a couple of Adobe CS6 programs in my old Windows machine, and while it's old it's fast and has a nice graphics card that can run a 4K monitor easily.

    So when I opened Audition and Encore, both had a tiny font since they are both from 2012. But Windows has a setting that allows old software to display at double size (or is it 4 times? I think it might be). It doesn't look amazing, but the text is perfectly readable.

    So that's all I'm asking for, but for macOS, so I can open Absynth, Battery, FM8, Massive, Kontakt 5 full version, all the software that back in 2014 I paid $500 for and it came with about 10 installation DVDs and took like two hours to fully install.

    I think virtual instruments should be like material ones. If I buy a cello today, it's not going to suddenly shrink to a quarter of its size 6 years from now, or ever. Then why should my old NI ones did?

  • IvoryKeys88
    IvoryKeys88 Member Posts: 26 Member
    edited September 2022
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    I have recently invested thousands of dollars into N.I. hardware and software, and I am extremely disappointed to find this thread. I was searching on here in the hope to discover what it was I was overlooking with regards to resizing the Komplete Kontrol window. It didn't occur to me this wasn't a case of user error, and instead is something N.I. is charging big bucks for the displeasure of using.

    Instead of finding the solution I was anticipating, I've found a vast number of people, going back many many years, on a long list of threads in both the old and new forums, asking for the N.I. windows to be scalable / resizable.

    Native Instruments ... what's going on here? How many years will your customers need to wait for even some basic GUI improvements? Just being able to make the KK window bigger would be helpful. Instead it's suggested by NI staff that your customers resort to editing files within your software? (e.g. I found this link after my comment on this current thread — https://web.archive.org/web/20220830072009/https://www.native-instruments.com/forum/threads/guide-custom-window-size-for-komplete-kontrol.349841/ )

    It's nearly 2023. Large and high resolution monitors are relatively inexpensive and extremely commonplace. Why is N.I. still pumping out more and more software and updates without addressing the fact it's all visually stuck in the dark-ages as far as computer displays and GUIs go?

    How about putting development of on-going Komplete releases on hold for a bit, and invest the time and money into sorting out your serious and long-standing GUI issues?

  • BylBobbaginz
    BylBobbaginz Member Posts: 1 Member
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    wow.. I was very surprised to see how many producers/musicians are, well, complaining about this issue

    SCALING..

    Granted, (as an ex-systems designer), IMHO, many older GUI applications were designed and programmed using inbedded FONT styles, most often, with older ones, written (hard coded) fo displays at 1280x1024; and some were even at lower resolutions.

    My suggestion is that Windows (at the least, I don't know about the Mac) has a facility to change the DPI settings of applications. to follow the rules set in the application itself (which is the real issue, bypassing the features in the OS hosting the app). Windows 10+ for example will let you set it to SYSTEM rules for scaling; These Native Instrument apps were developed ignoring this facility in Windows. Perhaps Mac has no feature to set or change this. So, to make software portable to other OS's, they usually will bypass this.

    This is the simplest change for the NI base code: have the GUI responsible to the DPI settings of the OS.. Windows CAN do this, can MAC? obviously the mechanisms will be different, so create an adapter to accommodate both. (make it metamorphic).. sorry if that is 'twilight zone' for many of you to understand, but the development department at NI should be aware of this; and get some people in there to fix the GUI part of your software layers.. NI's apps have always been awful awful displays; using the 'magnifier' tool on the OS is really stupid and very awkward to use.. This is the case with ALL the standalone NI apps, some of the newer ones are offering some scalable resolutions.. the BEST software plugins out there are ALL doing this, I suggest you get on board with this industry standard.

    I never understood why the greed backed decisions that force the final product to be Non-Standard; In this day and age, making software portable and conform to OS pathways is the safest way to create software and have the easier ability to PORT the code to different OSs.


    Thanks in advance guys.. I've been using NI for over 10 years; now with 4K monitors OMG it's horrible.. I read a guy used his smartphone to take pictures to zoom in.. this is really an awful design decision, and since NI is the only software available at this commercial level, well they are more apt to enjoy their profits than to really really consider what USERS want.. NI is in existence for the USERS, not their profits.. sad, huh?

  • Thomas_D
    Thomas_D Member Posts: 2 Member
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    Just adding my voice to this issue: it's just sad that in October 2022, following a new release of Komplete, we're still having to contend with tiny, non-scalable GUIs on our 4k/5k screens. Granted, NI have taken a step forward with Kontakt 7, but the hosted instruments are still tiny, in particular the guitars (e.g. Electric Mint, Prime Bass), other sampled instruments are slightly bigger (e.g. Playbox, Ignition Keys), but still not scalable? I can't believe NI Developers / Designers are still using HD monitors, or maybe they all just have unbelievable eyesight?

  • Jon Watte
    Jon Watte Member Posts: 77 Advisor
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    My suggestion is that Windows (at the least, I don't know about the Mac) has a facility to change the DPI settings of applications

    There are three problems with this:

    1) This screws up the arrangement/positioning of all other windows on the screen.

    2) This means that I have many fewer pixels available for other tools, like my mixer, and DAW.

    3) It looks really bad. Blocky pixelated characters aren't particularly easy to read.

    Let's hope for next year's update. We can hope.

  • SH-1
    SH-1 Member Posts: 33 Helper
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    My guess is that at NI and even more so iZotope, a lot of people are still thinking it's the late 90s and they are catering to a macOS market first and Windows second, if at all. You can see it with the recent Neutron 4, Ozone 10 and RX 10 releases by iZotope... They are not HiDPI compliant, and all the marketing guff around them is mysteriously screen recorded on macOS.

    Because macOS always detaches all windows and therefore every window is DPI aware on an OS level. In Windows, DPI can only be set per process and not per specific window. And so unless you are fine with an extra process for every window, you'll have to scale the whole application instead, and live with a blurry UI.

  • Xlorntabis
    Xlorntabis Member Posts: 1 Newcomer
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    I was new to Native Instruments when I got my s61mk3 a couple years ago. I spent a lot of money on plugins and such, only to find I can't see any of it. It's just so tedious and doesn't help with my goal of making music at all. I like the way the keyboard feels. But struggle to find anything positive about a GUI that should have been abandoned a long time ago.

  • David Birdwell
    David Birdwell Member Posts: 11 Member
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    I would still love to see the Kontakt window be stretchable vertically for tall monitors (or monitors turned sideways)

    I was REALLY hoping to see this on Kontakt 7 - but no such luck yet

    Is there any way to suggest this officially?

    I'd still love to see a long list of all the loaded instruments in the Kontakt window

  • asrivarde
    asrivarde Member Posts: 2 Member
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    im so pissed off with native instruments, i spent 1200 dollars back in 2014 on a crossgrade special where i bought komplete 10 and maschine. Ever since i got a 4k projector my native instruments scale very badly where i cant see the font even after setting font in my window settings to 300 percent, its unusable where i basically have vaporware software i cant use anymore, im so pissed with native instruments and izotope since thats who i believe has taken over now that i refuse to ever buy another native instrument product until they address scale issues. if they can add scaling then i will upgrade until then, im never giving them another dime

  • SteveECrane
    SteveECrane Member Posts: 12 Member
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    All,

    My penny's worth:-

    It seems to me that no matter how many of us ask politely - or, indeed "scream" as one Community user suggested - nor for how long we do so, NI will do precisely nothing until someone internally decides to make the requisite change. NI are NOT a listening organisation; they develop against market research for an ever-narrowing community of users (those who like sample playback as a form of music creation, it would seem) and are held to task by the venture capitalists who own the company, not its customers. And they're only interest in one thing: a decent ROI.

    [wx-NI CEO, Constantin Koehncke, "Con", was in charge of N.American marketing and was a DJ; he's now

    Like many here, I left the NI fold when they decided to abandon the Kore ecosystem (2011) in favour of Maschine, leaving me with an expensive doorstop having spent hours, days, weeks and months - quite literally - trying to get it all to hang together and understanding how to use it. Stability and usability wasn't its strong point! The following was my choice - to reward failure with yet more money or look elsewhere:

    "All owners of the full versions of Kore 1 or Kore 2 (excluding software-only versions) can purchase Maschine at a special crossgrade price of $449 / €399."

    I chose not to and looked elsewhere; I'd spent enough on a company which disrespected its user base so much and held users in contempt when they asked for a small investment of time, effort and money in areas other companies were automatically delivering at the earliest possible opportunity.

    Prior to this, I had invested in all sorts of NI goodness, having upgraded to the latest Komplete several times - believing NI to be reputable - only to find multiple VSTi's I had paid for cut from the development / support programs on a whim and a hardware ecosystem abandoned with little incentive to move other than risking yet more of my hard-earned cash in an unproven platform which seemed to have a focus outside of what more traditional synth musicians favoured.

    As others here have posted, I then spent absolutely nothing on NI products for over 10 years. Earlier this year I bought a second-hand Komplete S25 controller keyboard for £35 and invested in one of their Kontakt instruments in a sale (as I had a voucher - one that actually worked, that is! These often come with T's & C's attached that are so restrictive, they're near-worthless). Even that didn't go to plan as the subsequent downloads failed and failed and failed again via Native Access. So I got hold of the .ISO and mounted the image manually and that too failed ... on THREE different platforms. It's since worked ... but my lessons has been (re-)learned the hard way, as per usual.

    My advice to the frustrated users on this forum, for what it's worth, is either:

    1) Simply learn to put up with NI and all their nonsense; or

    2) Move to companies like Arturia, Spectrasonics or EastWest who have bent over backwards during the past decade to make sure I can write music, not become my own Tech Support department.

    Seriously, they've logged on to my music platforms and resolved the issues as I've watched. Where s/w hasn't worked - usually following a major revision change or update - they've offered me either complimentary upgrades or made offers requiring a nominal investment to resolve the issue and receive the latest and greatest version of their music-creation tools. And talk about responsive - all hours, day and night, 7-days a week!

    Instead of having an Artist Board with 29 Grammy awards (from 77 nominations) and over 10 billion streams collectively, why not have some representation from the people that actually have hands on experience of your software ... and who actually pay for it? That way we, your actual customers, might start to believe you're actually serious about listening to us, NI ... not from having people for whom another thousand dollars isn't going to affect their monthly floristry budget or the running costs of their wine cellars!!!

    Parent company (SoundWide) ex-CEO Mark Cattini stated only last year that, "Going forward, we’re asking ourselves: ‘What do our community members need to tap into their ultimate creative workflow and how can we help get them there?’ By first uncovering and understanding our community’s needs, we can map out our goals and move one step closer to the future of sound."

    Really!? No one asked me. Anyone else here asked?

    Is that why you're no longer in post, Mark, and some bloke called Rob Singer has the reigns? Having done the Executive shuffle (like you did at Salesforce, MapInfo and Autotask, et al) merged NI with Izotope and created SoundWide, you've now bu88ered off too! I bet that netted a healthy pay packet. Absolutely no skin in the game as far as music production is concerned; none whatsoever ... which is why NI simply continues to follow the money.

    If you were listening, Mark, then you'd have actioned some of the long-outstanding requests and would have no need to refer to already highly-successful artists who have little vested interests in NI (or the SoundWide group) or its products. All you would need to have done was read your User Forums and engage with your paying customers more directly, instead of attending red carpet events and long lunches full of venture capitalists and other such 'investors'.  Stephan Schmitt and Volker Hinz - and even Daniel Haver and Mate Galic - must be so proud of what's been achieved lately at NI. Such a high focus on actual music creation, as opposed to pleasing shareholders and investors.

    If this was true, SoundWide, "Everything we make is designed to keep you in your creative zone" then you'd've invested long ago in updating the UI of all of your products - THIS is what your users want, not all the high-falutin rhetoric, corporate B-S, carefully worded press releases and empty platitudes we, your customers, keep on receiving!

    Now SoundWide has another new CEO, namely Rob Singer, that well-known executive who's looked after multiple music, creative and arts companies. Actually, it's virtually none! Just latterly it was "Remitly", a leading global digital remittance company, and he's on the Board of a rug-making company. The closest Mr Singer came to the creative industries was "Smule" - an online karaoke site, no less(!!!) - and "StubHub", erstwhile seller of overpriced tickets for the entertainment sector.

    But, not to worry, he seems to average less than 3 years at any employer and often much less; in fact Ancestry.com kept him for almost 6 years - he must've gained loads of relevant and worthwhile experience there about the creative industries, what with all those dead people(?)! And he does specialise in "ruthless execution", so things are going to get done! Like an update on the SoundWide website (and Wikipedia for that matter) with a formal introduction to this new CEO at some point, eh?

    So, with a provenance like that, we all know NI is in safe hands, don't we!!!?

    Rant over ... for now.

  • b360
    b360 Member Posts: 1 Member
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    It would also help if contrast were adjustable, or a light mode were added, too. (Light mode would be preferable.) I just downloaded the free version of Komplete Kontrol to check it out and can barely read some of the text. I've given up on the introductory tutorial for now.

    Search Google for "dark mode accessibility problems" to read about some of the problems of dark mode for people with eye conditions like astigmatism. I can barely see some of the icons. I ran a screenshot through an accessibility checker and it fails.

    For example, this text is extremely difficult to read on a high resolution MacBook screen due to the low contrast and small size of the text:

  • Claudio Porcellana
    Claudio Porcellana Member Posts: 7 Member
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    I am one of those asking for bigger fonts, because the GUI is actually resizeable, but the fonts remain Lillipuzians

    There are a lot of other complaints about "oddities" in this clumsy GUI, but this is not the right place to drop them

    I see that this issue is very old, so I hope the KK customer-base become decrepit very soon: maybe that will force lazy devs to improve the GUI 😁

  • Claudio Porcellana
    Claudio Porcellana Member Posts: 7 Member
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    P.S: I always hated KK, and I've surrended only because the NI Sunburst guitars and West Africa...

    The day suitable guitars and African plugins will come out, I’ll Kill KK with no reKrets 🤣

  • Claudio Porcellana
    Claudio Porcellana Member Posts: 7 Member
    edited January 2023
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    BTW, for those asking to have big fonts, and no hope to have them before the next Big Bang 😂, there is a workaround

    Maybe it doesn't work in any OS and system, but in my case (Windows 10 and two 1920x1080 22" monitors) I increased the font size by 150%, and I am able now to see the KK GUI without ruining my sight

    There are also drawbacks, because some pieces of software I use at work doesn’t like that, and I cannot set my graphic card to have 2 different settings for work and music, because any further shortcut I add may interfere with the ones I use for working, but I think that if a device is used for music only, it can be an ultimate solution

    my 2 cents

  • Jon Watte
    Jon Watte Member Posts: 77 Advisor
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    I don't think the devs are lazy, I just think there aren't enough of them, and I think they're told to work on other things by the people who sign the paychecks.

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