Access 3.40 no longer remembers my login
Answers
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No, i did understand perfectly PoorFellow. And you did very well to look for this and to report it.
But i'm just saying that until NI come with a fix it has no practical use.
Also it does not explain why this is not happening to me or to others too, since we have the same system. Every time i open N.A. it just opens...
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@Jeremy_NI , (and @Jorgen Kirksaether ) I am sorry for tagging you twice but I do not know if you already read the first comment with your tag ! .
I have taken my trouble-shooting a bit further. In so much as I have discovered that the problem with the NTKDaemon appear to be a problem with the timing of the loading of the NTKDaemonService . If I go to the Windows services and set the NTKDaemonService to starting Automatic(Delayed) and then after Windows re-boot then wait until the NTKDaemon process has loaded after the delay and only then start the Native Access then the problem with the password does not exist. (@ Jorgen Kirksaether , this is for demo purpose only ! and please notice that if you do this and then tries to start Native Access to early then it will provoke Native Access to re-install it's services again. You can watch when the NTKDaemon process has loaded in Task Manager window)
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You come across as being either negative or playing wise with the obvious when you try to make a point out of the obvious. Of course it has no practical use to kill the NTKDaemon and watch it re-install it's services. But as I have already pointed out to you one time then it is for trouble-shooting purposes and when I called it the only 'intermediate solution' then I were not suggesting it as a solution but merely suggesting that there would be no other solution than take a look at the NTKDaemon problem.
And as you can see in the above then I have pushed even further in locating the cause ! (a timing issue - apparently not present on your PC)
And NO , before you start again, a delayed load of the NTKDaemonService is NOT A fix either !
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I thought (judging from other posts), that so far you understood that this is how i express my self. I like to be explanatory and yes, sometimes i state the obvious. Maybe is a bad habit, or maybe i know from experience that, what is obvious for you and me, is not necessary obvious to others. Nothing to do with been negative or been wise.
Anyway, lets move forward, shall we? :-)
What is your opinion about what i wrote few posts above, about cookies etc.? Do you think that maybe is not relative to the problem? Because in my case at least, NTKDaemon is not causing problems. So, maybe we are dealing with a multi-cause case here? Or something deeper? Perhaps a Windows setting that make NTKDaemon service to behave differently on each computer?
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Since you both comment on the past and suggest that we leave it then I will just in good order state that since I even in initial post findings clearly wrote "As a demo try the following" , then taking anything written after that as anything but that would be and have been wrong - also by you , if still fine by you then let us leave it at that . <self censorship exercised>
As for your present question , then even if I want to be kind then I can not see how an error relating to the order by which Windows 10 loads services when it starts has to do with cookie settings in internet browser. The problem with passwords are clearly because that the NTKDaemonService gets the NTKDaemon process to start premature on effected PCs , of which I have understood yours is not one of !
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1- Everything is fine by me, always. Do as you feel! :-)
2- About the service: I still can not see the connection! Because, yes you are correct about "NTKDaemonService gets the NTKDaemon process to start premature on effected PCs", but Native Access is not running when you start your PC. In fact, we only open Native Access once in a while, to check if there is some update, we don't have it run on computer day to night. NTK Daemon is running but the login details are bounded with Native Access, not with NTKDaemon. At least this is what i know, i might be wrong though. And about cookies, i wrote clearly that Native Access is a web application. All web applications use cookies, it has nothing to do with browser. Skype, is a good example of this.
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About your point 2.
You must be right when assuming that Native Access access uses some kind of web components either components built into Windows, or put on top of Windows by e.g. some Dot NET extension or some third party extension. Also some of that could be used by the NTKDaemonService / NTKDaemon process but even if then , as I wrote earlier , then what I have ascertained is that it appears to be a question of timing / loading order as far as the problem regarding the NTKDaemon and the password problem.
However I do not possess enough knowledge of the inner workings of the Native Access app nor of the of the NTKDaemon to tell exactly what is in play... Even if I could then I could not be bothered to try to hack into any of this to find out. Both might it be illegal and seen as reverse engineering even if done for trying to assist but also it would be completely beyond the scope of me using N.I. hardware and software for making music.
In the same manner it would be meaningless , at least for me , to continue to guess about stuff I have no knowledge of and have no intention of keep poking into if can be avoided. It would simply be a big waste of time the lack of insight provided by N.I. that is. Also , for me , JOB DONE ! , I have given a more than adequate pointer to where to look for root of problem to N.I. .
If N.I: will not fix the problem then I will most likely be looking into modifying the load order of services in Windows , which I might do anyway for general Windows tinkering purpose....
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I did some further research and found some more info, that might be helpful for you or others:
1- On my system, NTKDaemon Service is starting Automatic and not Automatic (Delayed). However i don't remember if its like that by default, or if i changed it, it was long time ago. Maybe it is that "delayed" which cause the problem, as you also mention. You may want to try this and see what's happening.
2- NTKDaemon Service is just a simple Local service, with zero dependencies by other services.
3- Neither NTKDaemon Service neither any other NI files are started at system boot or at Windows logon. Everything start after Windows fully open and after every other startup file (antivirus etc.)
4- Anyway, after that, i stumble upon a very interesting article by one of Native Access creators, which states that: "the functionality was decoupled from the interface, and two separate entities operate the system: one is the new dark-themed Native Access (NA2) interface you see today, the other being the NTK Daemon, responsible for activating, downloading, installing, and managing your products. You can think of it as NA2 being the button and the Daemon the wiring and the cogwheels."
It doesn't mention anything about accounts, logins etc. So, it still makes no sense to me why NTKDaemon should cause such a problem with logins. It has to be Native Access itself (note: this is just my logical assumption and it might be wrong).
...i stop here for now, because i got really exhausted with all these...
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I am sorry to have to tell you this , but despite all your apparent effort here then you come across as you understood very little of my previous posts and you seem incredibly caught up in doing your own thing.
I clearly wrote, and I quote "If I go to the Windows services and set the NTKDaemonService to starting Automatic(Delayed) " , then in doing so I am indirectly telling that this is not the standard setting - why else would you have to go set it ??? Then I also end same section writing that : "this is for demo purpose only ! and please notice that if you do this and then tries to start Native Access to early then it will provoke Native Access to re-install it's services again."
Then you even tag me and begin to lecture me about stuff that it ought to be obvious that I knew (+ a hell of a lot more) else I wouldn't have been able to troubleshoot this problem.
In the end then it all ends up looking like you think that since you were not the one solving the problem then the least you could do were to come around and try take all the credit for solving it !
This time around I really do get why that other guy became so annoyed with you since you by now here have made points out of the obvious and starting lecturing people like what I discovered were maybe not right because , you know all that much better , despite it were not actually you that were able to find the root cause of the problem..
Anyway , N.I. changes to this forum has induced some problems that while they may never become obvious to some people have become very obvious to me in a very short time so I really don't care. I mean do what you feel like , which is also by your own description what you do do !
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The truth is that I am very persistent and never give up until i find a solution, on any problem i'm dealing with! This, is a virtue, a "skill", whatever you like to call it, it is not something "bad". Sorry if that bother others, but really is not my problem. You have to chill out with this kind of criticism.
The other truth is that, indeed some times i am careless, reading very quick and loose some details (such as the "and set the NTKDaemon"). On this case, i got "busted", you are correct.
The third truth is that i got really tired of answering on such criticism and false assumptions every while, from people that have the wrong impression that they "know me". So from now on i will totally ignore such comments and whoever writes them. Yet, any time you or anyone else, are constructive and cooperating, i will be there to help and contribute.
Cheers
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Quote : "The truth is that I am very persistent and never give up until i find a solution, on any problem i'm dealing with! This, is a virtue, a "skill", whatever you like to call it, it is not something "bad". Sorry if that bother others, but really is not my problem."
NO ! , that were me you were describing HERE , NOT you , I were the one with the persistency here , NOT you , I solved the problem , the fact that you makes an issue out of spreading doubt and questioning my every move here and then come up with a narrative that put's you in the driver seat does not change any of that - at least not to anyone with the capability to read and understand. You have shown fail to understand on most of what have been obvious of what I write in as much as you have kept going on like I have written largely nothing and as if everybody else have the need that you come around clarifying that I am wrong and you are right ! Then when someone points out all of this to you then you starts acting like a victim and like everybody is out to get you , rather than maybe you start waking up !
The really funny thing here is (not funny ha ha) is that I am actually a person that are capable of appreciating that you *do know* a lot of things about a lot of stuff in as much as you are very experienced and I am sure that if I had a program related question then you would probably be one to be able to add a lot of both useful and educational comments. However NONE of that makes it OK that you sometimes acts like if you were some headless chicken (or more accurately Rooster) , acting like completely uninterested in what other people do or writes while trying to make yourself look good in doing so !
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@Rich_NI Is that a known issue? Is it fixed with the next update / hotfix as well?
Deleting the folders worked for me for the next time I ran Native Access. However, the time after that, I had to enter my login details again so it only appears to be a temporary fix. It's frustrating.
Can you check @PoorFellow posts here?
I appear to have nailed problem down to something related to NTKDaemon and nothing to do with password not being remembered.
As a demo try the following. Log into Native Access , then close app (do not log out) , then restart PC , when PC is restarted then FIRST thing you do is to do a CTRL+ALT+Delete and bring up Task Manager , in Task Manager kill the process NTKDaemon (there ought to be only that one by that name). Then and only then start your Native Access , you will see that Native Access is suddenly unhappy and starts to re-install it's services , but what you should also notice is that the app log-in by itself so will see that it actually has remembered the log-in credentials and that is is just because of something wrong in connection with the NTKDaemon that it does what it does !
So only 'intermediate fix' for not having to put in password again is to kill the the NTKDaemon after every startup of Windows and let the Nativa Access re-install it's dependencies every time you start it first time after starting Windows ! (or that one delays the NTKDaemonServices , please refer to my other post on page 2)
I have taken my trouble-shooting a bit further. In so much as I have discovered that the problem with the NTKDaemon appear to be a problem with the timing of the loading of the NTKDaemonService . If I go to the Windows services and set the NTKDaemonService to starting Automatic(Delayed) and then after Windows re-boot then wait until the NTKDaemon process has loaded after the delay and only then start the Native Access then the problem with the password does not exist. (@ Jorgen Kirksaether , this is for demo purpose only ! and please notice that if you do this and then tries to start Native Access to early then it will provoke Native Access to re-install it's services again. You can watch when the NTKDaemon process has loaded in Task Manager window)
I tried to quote all the info here, as this thread is a bit cluttered now, correct me if sth is missing @PoorFellow and thanks for tagging me.
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@Sunborn Even if your intentions are surely good, please don't go in such lenghts and argue when there is no point, if you are not sure. It's only getting more difficult for everyone when you have to go through all this. Native Access issues are already annoying and complex enough.
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I understand. I will keep it more simple! :-)
Though it will became much easier for me when finally the forum bring one the "unfollow post". You see, i get all those notifications and i am too curious, so i always go back and try to say something more...
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Hello,
I don't want to play the "smart guy" but i just saw this on Native Access 2 FAQ and i feel that i have to share it. Doesn't this explains a lot and simplify things? Are everyone of you who have the problem, actually logged-in on website, while you use Native Access? Maybe you perform a logout on website and this is why Native Access asks for password every time? And, in my case, it never asks, because i never logout from the website?
https://www.native-instruments.com/en/specials/native-access-2/
If this sounds stupid, or invasive, or has been written already, i deeply apologize. This will be my last reply on this post. 🙏
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