Very slow browsing in KK 3.x and Kontakt 8

UdoBehm
UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member
edited May 19 in Komplete Kontrol

Browsing speed for Kontakt 8 (in the library) is the same than for Komplete Kontrol 3.x

Dear @Matthew_NI (@Jeremy_NI, @Bruno_NI): I don't hope you (still) want to tell me that you see no difference and that everything works as it should??? I highly disagree!!!!

You can see that KK 3 and Kontakt 8 (in the library mode) are much slower than the previous KK 2.9.6 was. And I've tried KK3 on a MK3 keyboard on a different system, so I know that there must be a bug with my computer or system or KK 3.x and Kontakt 8 as I've already seen KK 3 working much faster than it does on my machine!

See here how fast the browsing can be on my machine and the former KK 2.9.6 on Windows:

https://youtu.be/ouGgNJxlSEk

…how fast it is on the Mk2 keyboard (version 2.9.6):

https://youtu.be/NzXwlsb-ClQ

…how fast it is in the Kontakt 8 side pane: https://youtube.com/shorts/-8SKe-tlrtk?feature=share

…and how slow on KK 3.x and Kontakt 8 (library view only! note that I click way earlier till the preset is being selected!!): https://youtube.com/shorts/wrRrp_D4cbM

…as well (slow) on the keyboard:

https://youtu.be/_RGu_oTSFqw
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Comments

  • Matthew_NI
    Matthew_NI Product Team Posts: 1,834 mod

    In our earlier discussions, I was referring simply to this video of yours, in which you browse two different ways, both of which seem fast and responsive.

    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/227005#Comment_227005
  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member
    edited May 19

    Yes. But if you look clearly on the video you will notice that the browsing in the library is much slower than in the Kontakt 8 side pane. It takes some time till new presets become selected. In the side pane scrolling for the first one or two seconds is slow too but then geos way faster...

    You have to imagine that I was holding down the down arrow and that it took so long till new presets became selected. Sometimes Kontakt even jumps over one or two presets. You can see this difference in my first video quite well too I think...

  • Matthew_NI
    Matthew_NI Product Team Posts: 1,834 mod

    This video you posted, purports to be the "slow" browsing.

    Forgive my ignorance, but what is slow here? So far as I can tell you are able to quickly scroll the presets.

    I can see that it's not quite as fast, but it's still fast - so it's hard to gauge exactly your expectations here.

    https://youtu.be/_RGu_oTSFqw?si=w-f3GRAdlGPszI7I
  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member
    edited May 19

    If I would use Komplete Kontrol 3.x in everyday use this "lag" is making Komplete Kontrol quite useless.

    It may be looking still quite "good" to you but if you were on the controller or the software you neither would want to work with it anymore, believe me...

    Sometimes the browsing is even hanging much more than you can see on the videos. KK still keeps browsing even I have finished rotating the encoder already, not even to mention that the preview sounds appear much later than on KK 2.9.6.

    Unfortunately you do not see how much time is passed when I click on the preset and when it becomes selected.

    It really is a mess dealing with KK 3.5 when it behaves like this.

    And interestingly the side pane of Kontakt 8 reacts as smooth as I would expect it. The older Kontakt versions (at least Kontakt 6, don't remember Kontakt 7) also were as I expected them.

    Would love to invite you to my place so you can see how bad it is to use KK 3 with this slow browsing speed and that you really should do a fix about this in my opinion...

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 3,352 Expert

    Man, I can see how utterly slow it is, especially competing to how KK V2 scrolls presets.

    I think the issue we have is devs either forget or are new and have never really used KK in its V2 days and what they see is "fast" but what us actual experienced users see is something much slower.

    I hold no home for any improvements. You kind of hope a new "tech stack" and a few years would have things working better than ever but seems they are still playing catch-up to the functionality of the previous software. Matt if you do not see/understand the issue, this is seriously part of the overall problem in development.

  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member
    edited May 20

    The interesting thing for me is that the same current software, Kontakt 8, allows both once fast browsing as in KK 2.9.6 times, but browsing in the main view of the instruments, in the library, is just as slow as in the current KK.

    @Matthew_NI @Jeremy_NI, @Bruno_NI Can't you go here and make both as fast as in the side pane in Kontakt 8, where everything works wonderfully?

  • dogbreath11
    dogbreath11 Member Posts: 136 Helper
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/227057#Comment_227057

    just updated to 3.5 and there is no difference, there is still a lag.

    kk2.9 didnt have any lag at all

    please make kk2.9 software work with mk3 keyboards. kk3 software has been a disaster from the start

    you would make a lot of your customers happy if you done this

    thanks

  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member

    …and the lag doesn't exist inside the Kontakt 8 side pane… So why can't you use the side pane functionality and make this available to KK and the Kontakt 8 browser??

  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member

    @Matthew_NI @Jeremy_NI, @Bruno_NI Is there still anyone here?

  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member

    NI, hallo?

  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member

    @Matthew_NI @Jeremy_NI @Bruno_NI NI?

  • dogbreath11
    dogbreath11 Member Posts: 136 Helper

    i read comments that having a lower preset count could be the reason why there is still a lg when cycling thru presets using the mk3 previous/next buttons so i deleted a massive chunk of my library.

    this made no difference, there is still a very noticeable lag when switching presets compared to kk2.9

    please fix this, im having total buyers regret with the mk3 keyboard and also kk3 software & kontakt 8.

    please hire someone that has the right vision, ni keeps going backwards

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 5,850 mod
    edited May 31

    That's odd I get zero lagginess browsing with the MkIII - only with the qwerty keyboard arrows (but that is much better since the last couple of updates)

    Yeah this does seem a different issue - maybe unrelated - the 'previews' issue (which turned out not to be related to previews at all) affected QWERTY keyboards and earlier models to the MkIII, and was database size related to a degree although I felt there were other issues involved too - maybe those are related to what is being seen here?

  • UdoBehm
    UdoBehm Member Posts: 112 Member

    I don't know. I checked out KK too on a different machine and had no lags either. However I couldn't compare what would happen if I added more (user) presets on this machine, if it would get slower too.

    The interesting thing to me though is that the library in Kontakt 8 is the same slow than Komplete Kontrol BUT NOT the side pane in Kontakt 8! This is working as fast as KK 2.9.6, as I would expect it!

    NI however seems to be totally uninterested in this issue what I can hardly understand as the 3.x or 8.x softwares are totally unusable to me like this...

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 5,850 mod
    edited May 31
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/228926#Comment_228926

    OK so it is system specific for you too. I had a similar issue with KK2 though so it's not perfect, on my old system it took forever to load and lagged terribly but since getting my M1 Max both versions have flown (apart from the more recent issue with KK3 and computer keyboards but tbh that wasn't really my issue, I was just trying to troubleshoot the problem, I always use the MkIII to browse or mouse)

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