Mac or Windows for Komplete 14

ste20man
ste20man Member Posts: 34 Member
edited September 2022 in Tech Talks

Hi.

I was a hundred percent going to get a 16 inch MacBook Pro m1 32gb 1tb. I use FL studio and was glad to see it will be able to run it.

I was getting this so i could buy and run ni komplete 14. Which looks amazing.

However, I'm reading that the mac wouldn't run certain bits of komplete and that it had to run in Rosetta.

I'm devastated cos the MacBook Pro is an amazing piece of kit.

Seeing as I'm probably not going to go with the Mac, what d should i buy?

Cheers, ste

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Comments

  • Monochrome
    Monochrome Member Posts: 1,064 Expert
    edited September 2022

    Right now, NI products are - with the exception of Guitar Rig 6 and Kontakt - not natively M1/Apple Silicon compatible. You may have seen this page by chance already:

    However, support is coming in the next months:

    Specifically, "all Komplete 14 products will support M1 / Apple Silicon natively early in the last quarter of 2022, with the exception of REAKTOR 6 and BATTERY 4 which will follow in the beginning of 2023."

    If you can wait and aren't afraid of using Rosetta in the meantime, just buy that MacBook.

  • chk071
    chk071 Member Posts: 342 Pro

    Take a look at the Asus Zenbooks, if you want to get a Windows PC.

  • Jojo123
    Jojo123 Member Posts: 220 Advisor
    edited September 2022

    IF you go Mac just be aware if you are going for an M2 version. There is no official support or a time given or how long the wait will be. Ive already asked about this on the forum and still waiting for an official answer. I'd definitely read exactly what NI have said about compatibility.

    Edit: Quote:

    Compatibility of NI Products with Apple Silicon M2 Processors

    Currently, Native Instruments products are not supported on computers with Apple Silicon M2 processors. The following information applies only to the compatibility of NI products with Apple Silicon M1 computers.

    Unquote

  • ste20man
    ste20man Member Posts: 34 Member

    After some reading I think I'm getting a better handle on things, I looked at the Surface Laptop 4(CPU underpowered I believe in comparison). I looked at Dell XPS 15 (latency problems), I looked at the Zenbooks but couldn't find anything that pulled on my heartstrings so on your advice I started to look into the MacBook Pro M1 again. Reading what you wrote I found a website showing that FL is "native" on the M1 now and that a heavy project had been cut in half from 55% CPU to 23%. Nice!

    I believe that Rosetta 2 is some kind of sandbox that allows intel plugins to "work" in/on Apple Silicon. I have read that you only have to run that once and then the Macbook will just "remember" it? Like when you first install Microsoft Word. (I'm not sure how that would work with Guitar Rig 6 or Komplete Effects for example. Would the Macbook "learn" all the effects for example first time and that would be it or would it need to "learn" plugins each time you switched the laptop on? - Obviously, a one-time deal would be great, I could really deal with that).

    Whichever way that worked would all the plugins etc. transfer over to being "native" when the update time came? Late Q4 2022?

    I will have my hands so busy just with the guitar rig that Reaktor 6 and anything else that comes next year.

    I guess if I could just ask 3 questions before I put my money down pleasse.

    Could you just describe briefly what it will be like to download Komplete 14? Is it going to be a one-click to get this Rosetta up and running and will I have to do it repeatedly day by day?

    I've read a lot but have got differing answers about the ever-talked about RAM. I'm gonna get the M1 CPU so that should be good enough from what I've read. It's gonna have to be cos I can't afford the MAX! lol. What would be great to know is 16/32GB RAM? Probs an eternal question. (I was surprised to understand that the chip was actually so important. I really can't afford the MAX so RAM is the only variable I have as I'm getting 1TB SSD whichever way, that will be defo be enough for me).

    I am really new to this at this level, my work was being blocked due to poor tools(that old hashtag lol).

    I'm wondering with a brand new out of the box 2021 MacBook Pro M1 32GB 1TB SSD, am I going to be able to use several instances of sampled Kontakt instruments? Can I Butch Drums, Electric Mint Guitar, a bass and Hybrid Keys all in one project and the thing will stay below 40%? 50%? I have no idea of how much stuff this is going to be able to take as when you move up like this you get better quality sounds if you know what I mean.

    How much can I expect to get away with with the M1 and 32GB?

    Have you personally tried or do you know?

    I'm basically going to buy one if you could just sort of help me understand where I'm standing regarding Rosetta and RAM etc. This seems in my gut to be the most futureproofed thing I have seen.......amazing speakers.....it looks great.

    The is ALWAYS windows which I love but this comes up all over when you type in best music production laptop, it's always top 3. I can afford the machine and Komplete 14 as a one off buy despite its expense, I just want to know if I'm on track as far as possible!

    You've both been amazing, any further help would be really appreciated.

    Thanks for your time in advance, ste.

  • Jojo123
    Jojo123 Member Posts: 220 Advisor

    Im on a late intel iMac so I cant answer about the workings of Rosetta2 but Im pretty sure you would need to run stuff inside Rosetta2 until native compatibility comes.

    Personally I would go for as much RAM as you can afford and dont get me started on Apple not letting people update RAM. Mine was one of the last that allows you to do it yourself, but in your position you have the make that decision from the start and you dont want to get that wrong. Im not altogether sure about this unified RAM and Ive heard conflicting things about it but importantly, some NI plugs are very resource hungry and some have different ways of dealing with it. You dont want to be running short on RAM only to have stuff getting swapped out and thus written to SSD a lot, shortening its life. I know once your'e ready to lay the money down, excitement can take over. Easy to do! I'd fully recommend being as sure you can about your own personal requirements, which is going to be different for each of us. RAM is still an extremely important Factor as far as Im concerned.

    Just be aware too, and Im sure you are, that there are other variables that come into it like how well the DAW you're using optimizes things. So much to take on board. My Mac does pretty well with 40 GBRAM and Ive never seen it swap to disk even once.

    Just a little headsup on downloading large libraries, a lot of people had issues with not enough disk space errors when I got K13UCE last year. I had the Komplete Disk but other things I had to download but I installed everything one at a time and didnt get into any trouble and my disk is smaller than what you're getting. Just make sure you have plenty of free space on that drive, as the installers need to use it to temporaily in the installation process, and you never want to fill it up anyway, as SSDs dramatically slow down if they get too full. With just 1TB internal, I take it you'll be using an external for your libraries. If not, you might like to consider that as well.

    HTHs. All the best with your purchase.

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 2,744 Expert

    @ste20man

    Have look at Microsoft Surface 8 Pro. One may not add RAM, but one may change SSD disc. Hard to say, if it has sufficiently strong CPU for your usecase.

  • ste20man
    ste20man Member Posts: 34 Member

    That does look interesting.

    I'm shying away from the Macbook Pro now, I've heard bad things about using Rosetta 2 and that even though NI have a roadmap for when things are going to get done, it might not be that way as it's a difficult thing to do and that they might be in trouble (120 staff layoff?). It's a proper shame cos I would have gone Macbook M1 straight away. I never imagined there might be compatibility issues after such a long time. Maybe next time.

    So it's Windows, which I'm happy with as long as I can get Komplete 14 up and running.

    One laptop I'm looking at is:

    Surface Laptop 4, i7 - 32GB - 1TB(Komplete 14 is 260GB in total - I won't use any more than 750GB so I think I'll be ok).

    Do you think that Laptop 4 specs will be ok for like 5 instances of Kontakt?

    Sorry to keep asking questions but as I've been out of this for a long time I have no grounding on which to feel.

    I'm just learning as I go trying to avoid buyers remorse.

    Thanks for your help!!!

    I really appreciate it , ste.

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 2,744 Expert

    I might try this week, how many Kontakt instances may run Surface Pro 7 (i5), that comes tomorrow. :-)

    But, it is not simple as that. There is Kontakt instance and Kontakt instance..... Some may need a lot of RAM, others are CPU intensive (AshLight, ....).

    It is only i5, has older CPU that runs on lower clock, but it might give some reference. I bought it to use Traktor and if it handles, also light music production....

    Also, there is not many notebooks with 6th gen AMDs, but IMHO they would make better service than Intels.

    -----

    K14 should be M1 compatible soon, in few weeks. Only Reaktor and Battery are sheduled for beginning 2023 (but several plugins are based/dependent on Reaktor...). Kontakt is already M1, so if that is the main concern, there sould not be a problem.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Member Posts: 2,462 Expert

    Is it imperative you have a laptop for production?

    There is always a trade-off when you select a production system. A laptop is convenient and portable but you will always give up performance and upgradability for the same invested cost.

    There are a lot of potential problems trying to run larger production projects on a laptop as there can be many different bottlenecks in the hardware, this is far more unpredictable when choosing a windows based laptop and what works for one will not always work for another and you kind of need a bit of experience in tuning a windows environment, BIOS/EFUI settings to get the most out of it and almost always you need a dedicated audio interface.

    If it was me and I really needed to have something that was as efficient and stable as possible while also being completely portable I would probably go with a macBook. However if I needed something that could be easily upgraded, have actual usable storage space that did not require a second mortgage on the house and an actual useful amount of IO available I would always shoot for a PC tower.

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 2,744 Expert

    Good point.

    I did something in between laptop-PC tower. I have built relatively strong PC (stronger than M1 Pro) 8C/16T @ 4+GHz, 64 GB RAM, 2x1TB NVMe SSD, two more positions for 2.5" SATA HDD/SSD, all that in tiny case (15x15x8 cm, roughly 6"x6"x3"). Using Noctua lowprofile cooler it is silent. It may have only iGPU and no firewire. If one needs dGPU or firewire, there is bigger brother of this case.

    It is very easy to transport. And one needs also keyboard and display. But, if one comutes between two, three places, no real problem.

    Beside that, I just bought Microsoft Surface 7 Pro (i5, 16 GB RAM). I have it mainly for Traktor, if it will run well, but beside that for light sketching in Maschine. It is easy to work with it using the pen and it looks like it may run up to 5 instances of Kontakt 4x Amati Viola and PharLight. So, relatively OK.

    And it is dead silent as it is passively cooled.

  • ste20man
    ste20man Member Posts: 34 Member

    Hi, thnx to all for the input, it's great to get decent advice when you're all at sea.

    I've ordered a Macbook Pro M1 MAX 64GB 1TB.

    I've done a lot of research on youtube mostly and the power and RAM are going to see me good.

    I don't often spend big amounts of money (which this is for me) but I'm happy and even excited to get hold of it and start actually getting stuff down. Things like the screen, keyboard and speakers are great, I just think that the whole thing is going to be sweet. We shall see. :)

    I'll check by as any more comments come on and give you a write back on what I think when I have been running for a fortnight or so.

    Thnx again for all your help, ste.

  • Ed M
    Ed M Member Posts: 139 Advisor
    edited September 2022

    I have a 2020 M1 MBP 16gb ram, which is peanuts in comparison what you are getting.

    I can confirm that even on my laptop everything works just great. Rosetta 2 installs automatically the first time you try to run any app that needs it. After that, it's done, no need to worry about Rosetta 2 anymore.

    Several instances of Kontakt, some other VST's, a bunch of effects on several channels, the laptop handles it without blinking.

    The only thing I needed to do is make my DAWS run in Rosetta, but even in Rosetta mode, no hick-ups. I mainly use Ableton, sometimes FL. The Rosetta mode will be a thing of the past soon, since all NI products will become AS ready in the near future.

    64gb of ram seems overkill, unless you plan on running a ton of heavy orchestral libraries, but at least your computer will be pretty future proof. Good luck with the laptop and have fun with it.

  • Kubrak
    Kubrak Member Posts: 2,744 Expert

    1 TB SSD is not much, even just K14U CE is more than 1 TB... One may use external disc... But have everything on internal one is way more pleasant....

  • Psyearth5
    Psyearth5 Member Posts: 100 Helper

    Hi everyone i didn't read responses but my setup is two instances of Realtor or Kontakt and i I treat them as HW so I record channel by channel and use Maschine MK3 and Resampling . My musical journey is exciting and successful I even get asked how I achieved such a warm sound and reverb is Raum the best effect which is much more than reverb/delay . Everything is possible when you want and the only advice is to keep Maschine and kits away from the sun and not to use them at high temperatures and Resampling is actually the answer, other artists ask me if it is Portal, Glitch mashines, cassette, what is it and it is Maschine MK3. I like to make techno live while playing I use internal instruments and after a while it sounds like who knows what. Internal plugins are very good, and I'm not talking about the biggest names. Saturator, Compressor, reverb, filters...Raum adds like a secret weapon because it gives endless colors and drones of short fast bass tones, it can do anything and always beautifies the complete sound picture. Of course, everything is ahead of its time, no matter what anyone thinks.Wave table modulations can be made using only internal plugins, Sampler and sample start options on long notes that modulate. Resampling is warm and fills the sound like no other program, of course some are better for fast transients and this one is in between so that the octave drop is lower and there is a sound that is a mystery. Contact instruments give an advantage, but everything is possible with others and you just have to adapt. I would like everything to work on Linux and not to think about the windows through which the wind blows, I'm collecting money for Maschine+ and until then I'm working hard and more and more requests for colab , I got tired but that's what I wanted and I love it. On the Maschine MK3 I was able to make all genres of music and what was the most difficult for me and that's PSY trance on Maschine MK3 is now the easiest. You should be grateful and invest slowly and first get the most out of the best Maschine instrument.

  • Psyearth5
    Psyearth5 Member Posts: 100 Helper

    Next time i will be more precise and in future i will be more specific and clear , because the main feature have to be used as advantage and then further CPU demanding instruments can be sampled and final product can be amazing. This is my every morning just to exercise brain muscle and to satisfy my ears . 5 minutes for Techno/Motivation music.

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