Traktor and CDJ HID

Michael Mashup

I can say today in my testing doing a simple A/B test by playing a loop of different tracks in Traktor and then linking a CDJ to traktor the processing of the audio changes basically its subtle, a loss of warmth and a thinner sound I then push the usb button on the cdj to go back to standalone mode and the audio returns to its normal state. Im calling you out on this Native Instruments why would you market and promote this feature for me to spend over £4000 pounds on CDJs that i cant use!!! Take down your marketing deception save somebody's hard earned money, I cant be imagining it you only have to google this topic

All audio routed through the DJM V10 no CDJ soundcard used.

lord-carlos

Is it possible for you to create an audio recording of this issue?

Michael Mashup

I dont have the time to debate it i have had this suspicion of this issue for years and didnt want to believe it was real, just watch youtube videos of dj performances with traktor in hid the sound quality is rubbish, and do you ever notice pro techno djs like dubfire, chris liebing, Richie hawtin etc. never have a cdj in HID mode i wonder why 🤔

mehighlow

Was that HID mode with audio aggregation (audio going from laptop, to cdj via usb, then through rca to v10) or HID without audio aggregation, laptop connected to v10 via usb, traktor using v10 as audio device, cdj in HID mode only as controllers (can work withouth rca connection to v10)?

leesinthemix

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/231563#Comment_231563

They don't use them, because their sets are synced 100% of the time and they play with four decks, so they don't need a CDJ

I've used Traktor HID with CDJs since 2009 and have never experienced the issue you seem to be describing.

I've also never used the CDJs as the audio interface, I use a Traktor certified mixer with an audio interface, before that I used an Audio 8 DJ and a pair of CDJ900s.

Xone 23C, 43C, DJM2000, 900NX2, Xone96.

I've owned them all at some point over the years and they've all worked fine with CDJs. In fact they work better than ever once you use them with an X1 MK3 and the built in USB hub.

leesinthemix

Have you done some A/B testing with different laptops and different operating systems?

Deejay Gucci

https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/231570#Comment_231570

when you have a table that has a sound card, 900NXS, NXS2, A9 or V10 usb only... + usb hub for the cdj

Michael Mashup

I use my system 100% synced too, another big hindrance to sound quality with HID mode with Traktor is when the CDJ is the master, Traktor needs to be always the master and the CDJs sync and follow only!, The CDJs weren't designed to be masters in HID Traktor control, when the CDJs are the master Traktor sounds weird yous can test this your self.

red_nick

How does that have anything to do with HID mode? It sounds like you're comparing:

DJM as Traktor's soundcard & mixer

DJM as the audio output & mixer for CDJ's playback.

HID mode doesn't come into it at all, nothing to do with actual audio output. Unplug the CDJs. Does the audio output change?

Michael Mashup

Exactly the complaint if all audio is being handled by Traktor and the DJM then in theory the CDJs in HID mode are controllers and and have nothing to do with Traktors audio engine output, To a/b test this is to put a track on a USB stick and put it in the CDJ, load up Traktor and load a track into a deck flac if you can and press play with your mouse, listen closely on the CDJ hit the link button and Midi connect with the encoder by now the HID connection will be made, then push USB on the CDJ and confirm with the encoder that your leaving Traktor hid control and going back USB/standalone do this pattern by the 3rd or 4th time you should hear the difference when hid is made the track looses its dynamics.

red_nick

No, your proposed test does not A/B test HID mode. HID mode is not audio output.

An A/B test for HID mode would be:

1. Connect Traktor to the DJM.
2. Test Traktor with CDJs connected in HID mode.
3. Test Traktor with CDJs disconnected from it.

You're talking about the differences between Traktor's audio output, and the CDJ's (or at least the DJM's interpretation of the CDJ's output). Not HID mode.

And you've provided 0 details of how you have Traktor setup.

• Do you have a limiter set?
• In your test do you ensure that the volume levels are the same? Failure to do so will mislead you.
• Which EQ mode are you using? Those with full-kill will change the sound.
• Do you have keylock on?
• Is your DJM firmware up to date? The drivers?
• You could also try using the CDJs as the audio outputs, to see if there's any difference?
• The product page says "Feel the warmth of natural sound and hear every detail." Maybe the Traktor output is the accurate one, and they're applying an effect to get that "warmth."
• Try playing audio directly to the DJM from some other software on your computer, not Traktor. Is the sound difference only in Traktor, or is it on everything when you use the DJM as a soundcard?

Why don't you make a recording to show us?

https://support.native-instruments.com/hc/en-us/articles/210273245-Does-TRAKTOR-Change-the-Sound-of-my-Tracks

Michael Mashup

That is exactly my point of complaint if all the audio is being handled by Traktor and the audio device e.g. a DJM or interface, why does simply making a hid midi connection not even selecting a deck change how Traktors processing its raw sound. The only way to hear this is on your own studio monitors.

red_nick

According to your own post, that's not what you've tested. You tested DJM as sound card vs CDJs reading files on USBs. Have you tested DJM as sound card without Traktor? Just play music directly using something else (preferably something that supports ASIO).

Michael Mashup

My test is to show that when CDJ HID connection connects Traktor processing of it audio engine is hindered, when you make the hid connection you don't have select a deck by this time the connection is made, then to leave hid control you hit the press the USB button on the CDJ and confirm your are leaving Traktor midi control by this your telling the CDJ to leave Traktor HID and go back into standalone mode this is when the audio returns normal you don't have to play the track that is on the USB stick, do this patten repeatedly on different tracks in Traktor on good studio monitors.

frankle

As a user of CDJ's in HID mode every week at my gigs I thought I'd read this thread …

And then for S&G's I thought I'd try the above connect, disconnect, reconnect etc … and see if I can hear anything …

And, NOTHING, not a single change in audio. I am unsure what you could possibly have wrong with your system.

And as a reference I was doing this on my 2019 MacBook Pro 16" running macOS 13.7.4 and Traktor Pro 4.1.1, using my RME Fireface UCXII as the soundcard into my Genelec Monitors with Genelec Sub using WAV files.

Michael Mashup

This is a studio test only, the first track is a good example but the lack of dynamics and garbage sound quality through the mix should be obvious https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHEW7TJIlIU&t=1750s