The Sheer Joy of 3.10.2
Comments
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I can confirm that VSTs are being scanned as well. It's in the Daemon.log file. It is going one by one through VSTs (U-he, AAS, Arturia, Plogue, etc). Each has a warning like this in the file:
[warning] [ 14:23:37] "488":ProductScans.cpp:655 No owned/active serials found for product: 9e7f7771-68c0-4067-9fcf-10ec4aa6993c 'Zebra2'
Why is it doing this? Why does it have to repeat this every time a new product is installed even in one session of NA?
Yes, I am sending the log via PM to Native Instruments.
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As I asked tempsperdu earlier, same question to you. What directory is your VST location set to in Native Access?
As it's software just for handling installation of NI products, ideally it be set to a directory where only NI plugins are kept.
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It is pointed to a separate Native Instruments folder in my VST directory. So, it does not appear to be confinining its search to that folder.
It could be scanning VST3 plugins, but that is in the common location for Windows machines. There is no setting in Native Access to restrict that further.
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If NA had problems with installing plugins in the folder of our choice, I think that this should be changed.
They should not tell us where to install things, specially if they give us the possibility to chose an installation folder in NA (and that’s why I don’t think this is the case).
In any case, we cannot chose a directory for VST3. It is predefined (differently from vst2)
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So if ya think about it, this scanning "feature" had to have been a requirement from somebody in the NI food chain somewhere.
This type of "feature" just doesn't happen. It has to be written, validated, and signed off on.
I couple that with what the Product Owner, or whatever his title was, that stated something like the NI problems are small. We have 100's of thousands of NA installs. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out they are data mining.
Just sayin.
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It’s annoying when you have a problem and many others don’t, it can be annoying when others say on their PC it’s fine.
Personally I think it’s useful to know others aren’t having the problem, as to me, that indicates that it’s not a bug affecting every system, not saying it isn’t a bug affecting yours, I just think it’s useful to know not everyone is experiencing it.
If it happened (I know this isn’t the case with you) that everyone else is having no problem, then obviously it points to a problem with your individual set up.
I have a problem with Presonus Studio One taking ages to load and then ages to browse any loops, it appears it’s just me having the problem.
I suspect it’s simply that My PC is so old (think I built it in 2013). It has 64GB DDR3 RAM, i7 3930K LGA2011, and everything else I do, any other music software I use, all loads with zero problems, I say zero problems, there are a few (not many) CPU intensive sounds that I get crackles when playing say 6 notes at once, regardless of what I’ve got my buffer size etc set to.
I am upgrading later in the year, but for now, everything works except for this Studio One loading problem. Their support was as helpful as they could be, but in the end as we’d worked out what was causing the problem, I said to close my ticket and I’ll make do until I upgrade.
If I deleted (or moved to somewhere that Studio one wasn’t looking in) my 16 biggest loops (downloaded from Presonus, included with my Studio one plus subscription, not 3rd party loops), everything works fine. If I put those 16 loops back again, problem returned. If I put the 8 smallest of these 16 back, while quicker, it was still unusable to browse loops.
To try and fix the problem (and as I could always use the M.2 SSD in my new PC, I even installed a PCIe M2 adapter and put in a 4TB M.2 Gen4 NVME SSD, then made that my C drive, reinstalled windows, this increased my C drive r/w speed from approximately 460MB/s with the old SATA SSD to 3640MB/s with the M.2. I then reinstalled Studio one using it’s default settings (as per suggestions from Presonus and their Facebook page) so all loops were also installed to this new drive, exactly the same problem, not a second faster. With those 16 loops, studio one unusable. I move those 16 loops elsewhere and everything is fine.
so I just ignore those loops for now.
I wished more people had this problem so it wasn’t just me, but seems I’m the only one. Again, I own a ton of stuff whether Omnisphere, Komplete 14 collectors edition, Arturia V collection, plus loads more and every single thing loads 100% fine except Studio One if I have those 16 files.
With your problem, I know it’s annoying when you are left to your own devices, and when everything else works, maybe temporarily simply rename your Plugin directories so that NI doesn’t see them then retry
That way you can eliminate plugins being the problem by moving them all (or renaming plugin directory
If the problem goes away, try moving half your -plug-ins elsewhere temporarily and see if the problem goes away, if it doesn’t, move the other half somewhere and put those back and try again, hopefully it’s now gone away. Then split the directory that still causes the problems in half and repeat etc etc etc.
This way you can get to what plug-in is causing it fairly quickly. I know it doesn’t help if you need that plug-in, but at least it can help you continue with your music while trying to find a remedy.
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Precisely.
I am not trying to diminish anyone's experience OR compare it to mine.
But for those of us who have done zero on our end except install our pile of updates like everyone else to the usual directories and use our products normally for months on end without any problems whatever - to try and make that sound like we are "special" or looking down on anyone else is simply lame.
It is simply a quick comparison from the field report that say "Hey - I installed what you installed and I am not seeing that behavior (yet) here".
Why anyone thinks this sort of update is malicious - is beyond me.
VP
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What we're trying to get over is that it's not being caused directly by the software - as if that was the case, every single user would be having the same issue.
Not at all as most people have a different software environment that NA2/ NTK Daemon are reacting with.
How is that so difficult for you to grasp?
I respectfully disagree. Determining where the fault lies and eliminating things is part of the fault finding process (and I've been involved in the business of fault finding as a career for decades).
No because for starters you are talking at rather than to anyone on here. If you try to solve a fault, you do it by inquiry and a process of elimination, not just telling people it must be their fault.
As I've indicated and as others have said, the problem is in theory the interaction between NI software and some other software, but at the end of the day it is the NTK Daemon in this case whose code is implementing the scanning. That may not explain all the other issues at all.
BTW, my location files in NA are to the respective NI folders
Hayo_ NI... thank you for finally responding on this issue, if I have an uncorrupted NTK Daemon log I'll pass it on.....
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OK I had a quick look at my daemon.log and it has a list of VSTs (not all NI) so presumably the others are what's in the shared VST3 system folder. I don't have anything that's not licensed or expired.
I was curious what would happen if I deleted it, so I had to kill NTKDaemon in order to do that.
When I then started up Native Access, lo and behold it took ages to start, sat trying to load products.
Are you guys killing off NTKDaemon or deleting the log files?
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I have only ever killed the NTKDaemon process. I didn't know the log file existed until the NI rep posted about it in this thread.
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OK I had a quick look at my daemon.log and it has a list of VSTs (not all NI) so presumably the others are what's in the shared VST3 system folder. I don't have anything that's not licensed or expired.
I was curious what would happen if I deleted it, so I had to kill NTKDaemon in order to do that.
When I then started up Native Access, lo and behold it took ages to start, sat trying to load products.
Are you guys killing off NTKDaemon or deleting the log files?
Just think how much time you would have saved yourself and everyone else had you done this earlier.....
Can anyone tell me where the NTK Daemon log resides?
Oops, found them, they are relatively large. I've forwarded them on to you Hayo_NI.
A quick glance at them is very disturbing as they seem to infer I have products installed that I don't have licences for ...that certainly isn't the case and why on earth would it be checking?????????
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I shouldn't have needed to do it earlier, because I assumed you were using the product correctly, running NTKDaemon and having a daemon.log file present.
If you've been deleting/renaming/moving files that are needed for using the product, you should have stated that from the start. You can't expect anyone offering help to know that's what you've done.
With everything in place, the software starts up and runs as it should, in five seconds or so.
It's only when those files are stopped or deleted that the problem occurs (because the log needs to be created again).
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I am using the product correctly...what makes you think I am not?
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I just had massive problems as well on my Windows 11 system after a "NA self-update" to the recent version NA 3.10.3.
NA restarted itself and asked for my credentials. But after entering those correctly, the application was claiming that I have tried too often to log in already with wrong credentials, therefore my account had to be blocked by NI. Really, are you still serious, guys?
I tried again to log in several times with correct credentials - with the same negative result. Only after the third PC reboot NA 3.10.3 finally accepted my credentials but then stuck at the "loading" screen as reported already by many others. After 20 minutes I gave up and killed the whole application again, rebooted my PC and started over. Obviously I had luck and I finally I made it into NA.
But what is the first thing any NI user must see now (if NA is finally working at all)? A completely unnecessary and fully redundant "home screen" with ads!
Please NI, can we have a preference option to set the "startup view" after launching NA so that the "Library" tab can be directly selected without unnecessary additional clicks? We are all mature customers and we know exactly where to order any NI products if we'd really like to do so!
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what makes you think I am not?
If you're reading thread and paying attention, it should be perfectly clear.
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