Komplete Kontrol VST2 missing after 3.0.0 update

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Rich_NI
Rich_NI Customer Care Posts: 173 mod
edited February 1 in Komplete Kontrol
«13456710

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  • B.Minor
    B.Minor Member Posts: 180 Advisor
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    @Rich_NI:

    I'm not sure if I got the statement above correctly on how KK will behave in the future.

    Let's say currently KK 2.9.6 is installed on my system (including VST2 + VST3 support) and for whatever reason I decide now to install KK 3.0.1 via Native Acces "over" that previous KK2 installation:

    • Will I then have the option to choose either to load KK2 or KK3 into my DAW? I guess not, correct?
    • Does your statment only mean that the VST2 accessability (as known from KK2.X) won't be dropped yet and will just be returning to KK3, while only the KK3 application will be the only option available?

    Thanks in advance for the clarification.

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 4,065 mod
    edited October 2023
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    I have this up and running right now - 2.9.6 as VST2 (and standalone renamed in a separate folder and also running in Rosetta mode so it can access my legacy VST2 plugins) and 3 as VST3, AU and standalone.

    I have not dared to have 2 different versions running at the same time but I have been able to select to load either the VST2 or VST3 in Reaper (which I also run in Rosetta mode just so I have one host on my system for legacy plugins like Absynth)

    The biggest challenge is although the 2 versions use different databases which was a brilliant idea as it reduces the risk of corruption, they still share the same plugin scanapp, so I had to backup scanapp v2 to run when I want to update the plugins in KK2, then revert to scanapp v3 (which I also backed up) when I want to update the plugins in KK3. This only needs to be done when I have new or updated plugins though

  • Rich_NI
    Rich_NI Customer Care Posts: 173 mod
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    Hi @B.Minor

    Let's say currently KK 2.9.6 is installed on my system (including VST2 + VST3 support) and for whatever reason I decide now to install KK 3.0.1 via Native Acces "over" that previous KK2 installation:

    • Will I then have the option to choose either to load KK2 or KK3 into my DAW? I guess not, correct?

    If you have a previous project that already contained the VST2 component, it will automatically load the VST2 version. If you are loading a new instance, you will have the option to either load the VST2 or VST3 plugin version.

    • Does your statment only mean that the VST2 accessability (as known from KK2.X) won't be dropped yet and will just be returning to KK3, while only the KK3 application will be the only option available?

    If you update to Komplete Kontrol 3.0.1 then this will be the version that will open as a standalone application. Only the VST2 version of 2.9.6 will be left on your system.

    I hope that clears things up a bit :)

  • B.Minor
    B.Minor Member Posts: 180 Advisor
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    Thanks Rich_NI and Kymeia for your clarifications.

  • Super8boy
    Super8boy Member Posts: 79 Helper
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    Well thank god for this.

    It's mad something like that hadn't been thought out more thoroughly in the rush to release the new hardware and software, but I'm glad that NI did listen on this and acted promptly to make the VST2 to VST3 transition smoother.

    I imagine it would have massively hurt sales if genuine reviews from paying customers on youtube and forums had all complained about broken projects with the Kontrol MK3 for those who had been using wrapped VST2 plugins with their KK (pretty much nearly every NI client to be fair).

    It might be worth making a video for it on the NI youtube channel, so new users don't scratch their heads for no reason.

    The smoother the experience, the more likely customers will recommend the product to others (the opposite is of course true)

  • Kaiwan_NI
    Kaiwan_NI Administrator Posts: 2,702 admin
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    Komplete Kontrol 3.0.1 update to address this issue has now been released.

    Just a heads up, VST2 will be phased out shortly. We recommend transitioning to VST3 as soon as possible.

  • LostInFoundation
    LostInFoundation Member Posts: 4,320 Expert
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    This is a welcome news, mainly for reassuring users about their previous projects not being at risk, but also for MK1 owners having the possibility to have both versions available on the same system.

    Just one question for clarification: “VST2 will be phased out shortly” doesn’t mean disappearing, does it?

    Because what I understood till now is that MK1 users will still need KK 2.9.6 in order to use their keyboard and if they have installed also KK 3, KK 2 remaining only in its VST3 version would be a problem

  • PascalHP HSMR
    PascalHP HSMR Member Posts: 33 Member
    edited October 2023
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    Hello,

    is it normal that the icon does not have an image,

    even the shortcut from the program is the same.

    3.0.1

    The Vsts take a long time to load, this is due to my hardware (windows 10, Corei5, 16 ram)

    Thanks in advance.


  • Martin_NI
    Martin_NI Product Team Posts: 24 mod
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    Hey @LostInFoundation


    The phase-out relates to how we keep Komplete Kontrol 3 and Komplete Kontrol 2 running on the same computer. With the 3.0.1 update, Komplete Kontrol 3 standalone generates the files required by the VST2 version of Komplete Kontrol 2. Since Komplete Kontrol 2 needs a standalone version on a system to create these files at least once. Komplete Kontrol 3 generating these files will continue for a couple of months due to some technical complexities that maybe we can get into some other time 😅


    The good news for users who want to keep a copy of Komplete Kontrol 2 standalone as well on the current version of their OS is that Komplete Kontrol 3 & 2 now use different generated supporting files, meaning each version has its own database and plug-in scan files, so they should co-exist a lot better. The two versions now also use a different ScanApp to allow each standalone version to generate its plug-in lists if power users want to take advantage of it.


    I strongly urge all Komplete Kontrol 2 users to start using the VST3 version over VST2, as this will allow a smooth transition when you decide to adopt Komplete Kontrol 3. If a user does not, they have to rely on their DAW to migrate projects from VST2 to VST3, and some major DAWs still have not implemented this VST3 hosting feature. Komplete Kontrol 3 is fully backwards compatible with Komplete Kontrol 2 DAW projects if the DAW has the feature.

  • LostInFoundation
    LostInFoundation Member Posts: 4,320 Expert
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    Thank you for all the explanations…but…still I have some doubts (maybe I’m slow to understand ☺️).

    My direct question is: will I, as an owner of Komplete MK1 keyboard, in future be able to have on my computer Komplete 3 (of course VST3) AND Komplete 2 VST2 installed and usable together? Because my fear is that if Komplete 2 VST2 will be phased-out and only Komplete 2 VST3 will remain, trying to open K2 VST3 will try to migrate things to K3 VST3…therefore making Komplete Keyboard MK1 usable only in its MIDI mode

    Hope I’ve been clear, since I’m not so sure I’m even clear to myself 😂

  • Martin_NI
    Martin_NI Product Team Posts: 24 mod
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    Hey  @LostInFoundation  

    The question is clear 😊 For the supported versions of macOS and Windows for Komplete Kontrol 2, this should be possible, though, as I mentioned, it may involve a little bit of a more complicated setup to have both on your system. You have to ensure to keep versions of Komplete Kontrol 2 VST2 in a directory that will not be overwritten by installing Komplete Kontrol 3. 

    We don't in any way want to stop users using Komplete Kontrol 2 or a setup with both. However, we don't have the resources to continue actively supporting a dual Komplete Kontrol setup from a testing and backporting bug fixes to Komplete Kontrol 2 perspective.

    Sorry if I am a broken record, but I want to ensure anyone else reading the forum does not miss the fact that it should be known that continuing to use VST2 in projects could cause issues later if your DAW does not support migration between VST2 to VST3. That is why we recommend all users start using VST3 over VST2 wherever possible to help seamlessly upgrading plug-in versions.

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 4,065 mod
    edited October 2023
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    No it’s a bit more complex than that - see my points above re the shared scan app. If it was possible for the 2.9.6 install to be self contained with its own separate version of the scan app this would be much easier to do

  • Kymeia
    Kymeia NKS User Library Mod Posts: 4,065 mod
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    OK just installed the 3.01 update and it seems NI have actually done what I suggested; there is now a separate scan app for KK 2 and KK3 - thanks NI for taking that on board :)

  • rdalcroft
    rdalcroft Member Posts: 186 Advisor
    edited October 2023
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    This method does not work for ableton, When it starts scanning the VST2 file it crashes Ableton Plugin scanner

  • Super8boy
    Super8boy Member Posts: 79 Helper
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    Can anyone confirm this on their configuration?

    are you on Ableton live 11 latest version (presumably)?

    what OS?

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