I have some questions about VST3. But in terms of mechanics under PC and Mac, not features...

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BIF
BIF Member Posts: 1,208 Guru
edited October 2024 in Komplete Kontrol

These are probably fairly easy for somebody in the know.

For Windows and Mac, if anybody knows how it works on either platform...

  1. Is there a registry key that shows which folder is my "official" VST3 folder? If so, what would it be on Windows? What would be the mechanism on Mac?
  2. Is there only one true VST3 folder on any given system for all time, or can some hosts or instruments override the "system folder" for VST3 VSTs? If they can override it, do they do it on a system basis, or can they do it just for their own purposes as a one-off change?
  3. On Windows, the file names in my "system" VST3 folder include both .DLLs as well as .VST3s. In general, I know what DLLs are, but I lack understanding of what makes a DLL work as a VST...and more specifically, as a version 3 VST. Can somebody give me a quick primer on how this works?

Background:

These questions arose while I was recently updating some VST Instruments. I've already removed "most" Version 2 VST folder concatenations from my hosts, but still have more work to do. Anyway, these updates are supposedly VST3, because they ended up with updates to

C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3

But there seems to be some unexpected behavior. One of the updates was the Musiclab RealGuitar and its sister guitar instruments. These required me to manually update the above folder with the new DLL and VST3 files as mentioned in each instrument's installation instructions. For Musiclab, I guess it doesn't copy the files into the aforementioned VST3 folder; not automatically, anyway.

So I copied the modules as instructed, but my hosts aren't picking up the new versions, which makes me want to confirm via the Registry if that folder really IS my VST3 folder, or if something else got bonked, borked, or overridden somewhere along the way. This issue is on Windows, and I'd like to see if I can chase it down and learn something in the process.

At the same time, I'd also like to learn how it all works on Mac.

Thanks in advance for any knowledge anybody can share or direct me to!

Comments

  • Ojustaboo
    Ojustaboo Member Posts: 352 Pro
    edited February 2024

    Windows registry you could try opening [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE] and search for VST

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,208 Guru

    Yep; that's on my to-do list, but AFTER dinner, lol. My Registry is crushingly big, and always takes a long time for searches to complete. No sense in being hungry during all that!

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,208 Guru

    Update:

    That's a nogo. Do you KNOW how many times "VST" appears in your registry? Just "vstsound" by itself will have me here for months.

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,208 Guru

    Update 2:

    Okay, so I changed my search to "VST3" and I'm getting a different story.

    It does appear that different hosts can and do set their own VST3 paths.

    That's the only answer I have at this very moment. More details to come as I learn more here...

  • Jeremy_NI
    Jeremy_NI Administrator, Customer Care Posts: 14,941 admin
    edited February 2024

    By default VST3 files will always be installed here: C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3, it's the norm for all plugin manufacturers and DAWs.

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,208 Guru


    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/comment/136404#Comment_136404

    Thanks. On my (currently) Windows 11 system, I actually DID find some other folders. But then I got distracted that night and never got back to my research project. I will do that and come back with some additional details.

  • Vocalpoint
    Vocalpoint Member Posts: 4,033 Expert

    I will add to Jeremy's post by reinforcing it with this Steinberg knowledge base article:

    VST plug-in locations on Windows – Steinberg Support

    "The VST3 format has a dedicated installation path all VST3 plug-ins must comply with. All your VST3 plug-ins should be installed here:

    "C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3"

    If you are seeing VST3 files anywhere else on your machine other than the location above - that specific vendor is feeding you a plugin that does not comply with the VST3 standards.

    VP

  • PoorFellow
    PoorFellow Moderator Posts: 7,357 mod
    edited February 2024
    https://community.native-instruments.com/discussion/26764/i-have-some-questions-about-vst3-but-in-terms-of-mechanics-under-pc-and-mac-not-features

    So this is what I have found for you ! It took some doing but I got there ! Apparently then only VST and VST2 has standard path set via registry key and apparently then VST3 has no standard path set via registry key, Try visiting the VST 3 Developer Portal !

    1) + 2) :

    VST3 Plug-in path

    The VST3 format has a dedicated installation path all VST3 plug-ins must comply with. All your VST3 plug-ins should be installed here:

    Format   Path   Extension

    VST3   C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3

    32-bit VST3 plug-ins on 64-bit Windows: C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\VST3   .vst3


    Source ! : VST3 doesn't need Registry key/value because plugins are always installed into C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3 (and subfolders), to follow Steinberg convention.


    Source for below :

    The following registry-key is set (win-x32):

    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\VST\VSTPluginsPath

    The following registry-keys are set (win-x64):

    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\VST\VSTPluginsPath

    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\VST\VSTPluginsPath


    Source ! : You can change your system's default VST paths in the Registry if you want. Some installers ignore it and install wherever they want anyway, but they're a minor amount


    By Jeremy :

    These are the standard locations on Windows that I'm aware of.

    VST3:

    C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3

    32-Bit VST3 Plug-ins on Windows 64-Bit:

     C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\VST3

    VST2:

    C:\Program Files\VSTPlugins

    C:\Program Files\Steinberg\VSTPlugins

    C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST2

    C:\Program Files\Common Files\Steinberg\VST2

    32-Bit VST2 plug-ins on 64-bit Windows:

    C:\Program Files (x86)\Steinberg\VstPlugins

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    3) :

    VST3 info light ! :

    VST vs VST3: What Is The Difference & Should You Care?

    What is VST? What's the difference between VST, VST2, and VST3?

    Wikipedia : Virtual Studio Technology

    February 10, 2011 , VST 3.5 — a milestone in VST development


    VST3 info Developer Class ! :

    VST 3 Developer Portal

    VST 3 Developer Portal Tutorials

    VST 3 Developer Portal Plug-in Format Structure

    Welcome to VST SDK 3.7

    The C API header of the VST3 API

    Book example : Designing Audio Effect Plugins in C++, 2nd Edition by Will C. Pirkle , Chapter 3VST3 Programming Guide


    Other Steinberg :

    Steinberg Developer Resource , SDK downloads + MIDI Remote API - Programmer’s Guide

    HALion Developer Resources

    3rd Party Developers Forum

  • BIF
    BIF Member Posts: 1,208 Guru

    Okay, so I got off my keester and looked up a few things.

    From my Windows 11 Registry:

    It appears that Cakewalk has some cruft out there:

    C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\Shared Utilities\Internal\Drum Replacer\DrumReplacer.vst3

    C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3\Rapture Pro

    I don't use Cakewalk anymore, and haven't really been good about updating it since they sold everything and the kitchen sink to that bandgroove or grooveband outfit...or whatever it's called. I still have my license, but I don't think it offers anything more than Cubase or Ableton Live.

    Groove_Agent_SE.vst3 <--- no reference to a folder name on this one

    here's one for Halion: HALion_6vst3_vst3PluginFolder <--- also doesn't appear to reference an actual folder name, and this also appears for Retrologue, Groove Agent, and The Grand, among other Steinberg instruments. I think these are just internal references to the standard folder at c:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3

    There's also a registry key called "C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\MusicLab\VST3\", but it appears to be null. I do remember that Real Guitar and its sisters all need to have the VST3 files (*.VST3 and *.DLL) manually moved into the standard VST3 folder on the C drive.

    Similarly, I have a registry key called "C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\VST3\Steinberg\", along with keys named that same value, but going one level deeper to Padshop, Retrologue, Retrologue\Documentation, and Retrologue\Help, but these too appear to contain null values.

    Folders on my hard drive:

    Cubase appears to have some temporary holding places for VST3 VSTs: C:\Program Files\Steinberg\Cubase 13\VST3

    The old Novation "automap" service/application did put VST3 VSTs into C:Program Files\(x86)\Novation, but I think Novation changed up how they do all this stuff now. I'm hoping to hook up one or both of my Novation controllers sometime this year, so I'll learn more about what's replacing automap these days.

    I think I also saw some folders dedicated to Ableton Live's VST3s, but everytime I try to re-sort my list of files and folders in File Manager, Windows 11 decides it needs to completely rerun the search...so I'm not going to spend much more time on this.

    So the upshot is this: I'm not doubting what folks are saying about where VST3's should go...it should be in

    C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3 for 64 Bit, or in C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\VST3 for 32 bit.

    But in my observation with the products I have, things "can" end up in different places, either as temporary holding places, or for some other reason that I don't understand.

    It's just something to note, mostly for myself. Especially since I'm actively removing VST2 VSTs, as well as 32 bit VST3s. The only exception is that I'll leave something alone if there is no 64-Bit version of it in VST3 form.

    Thanks for all the input!

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