Komplete Kontrol - option to open with no scan, background scan or normal.

stewart hannah
stewart hannah Member Posts: 2 Noise
edited February 2 in Komplete Kontrol

Bought my S49 a while back and whilst I love it to bits been preoccupied with other instruments - my new guitars. So this morning I start Komplete Kontrol to update any upgrades and additional plugins I have added/removed since it has been a while since I last opened the standalone app.

I bought the Behringer X32 mixer during lockdown and treated myself to the Waves Audio card and waves software bundle and I find Komplete Kontrol HATES WAVES and hangs on numerous Waves plugins. I have to end task Komplete Kontrol and end task the Scanapp and remove the plugin bundle folder from program files x64\waves directory cos I need it to complete a plug in scan preferably sometime today not next week. It hasn't crashed it just hangs for hours and the Komplete app my vst2/3 folders are all on M2/SSD drives so speed it not an issue !!! After removing the waves plugin it hangs on waves shell obviously cos I removed the dll plug in folder as above??

Whilst I would agree Waves install is a mess since it stores critical data dlls etc all over the damn place my DAW never complained and updated the plugins as normal KOntrol on the other hand just refuses to be nice???

So my next option is I have is to create another identical vst2/3 folder and remove the waves shell plugins just so I can use Komplete Kontrol ??

Why is there no option to open without a scan and then scan in the background or for the start screen to give us a little more info on why its taking so damn long to scan specific plugins? Or an option to skip a plug in or the whole scan?

Without the Komplete Kontrol app the keyboards are next to useless and having had issues with it before was one of the reasons I also bought the Naktar 88+ cos it obviously works without Komplete.

sorry for rant but Im really cheesed off this morning with NI and its software, who I know will blame Waves

Comments

  • soundtrax
    soundtrax Member Posts: 9 Sine

    Similar but slightly different problem here - Komplete Kontrol scans through my Arturia V Collection 8 every time I launch KK. No problems with my waves plugins though.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Custom NKS Libraries: freelancesoundlabs.com/nksMember Posts: 386 Saw
    edited January 28

    When you launch KK (as with almost any software that uses plugins) a VST scanner will check your plugin locations on start-up looking for VST plugins. A list will be built of all plugins, vendor details, plugin version type, capabilities of the plugin (instrument/effect). All this info is needed to display the in-app menu of plugins so on every start the program will check these locations.

    Now, if a plugin was already scanned in the list and it's size/date has NOT changed since last scan it should be quickly skipped over and you will often see this as a "fast scan" when KK loads and it simply goes on by. If a plugin is detected as changed since last scan (such as an update) then that plugin will be interrogated for its details which slows it down.

    Now, if you have a mess of an installation where you are forced to add multiple plugin paths because you don't pay attention to the location of installers, this can become problematic if you happen to have the same plugin installed in multiple locations and at some stage update one of the plugins in a location because on EVERY start the scanner will see one version of the plugin, then the other and will constantly try scanning that plugin on every launch. If you are always experiencing plugins being scanned for a long time on start, this will be one issue you have, duplicate plugins somewhere. Another issue can be if you have paths set where you have a lot of other "non-VST" plugins such as if you be lazy and just set "C:\Program Files" for instance as there is a lot of files to check through and verify.

    For instance, I have 250 instruments, 113 effects (not including Waves 13 Mercury) and a further 206 Waves effects and starting Komplete Kontrol when no updates have been done takes about 5 seconds to progress through these plugins.

    A note on Waves. They are re-tards! Sure there are a few nice plugins but if I had my $1k to spend again I would not buy Waves personally. Their installer has a fixed install location at C:\Program Files\VSTPlugins so if you have a custom location you have to copy these to your actual path and every update you need to remember to recopy these. If you do not, this can cause issues every time you launch a program. Also, keep in mind with Waves they use a "WaveShell" container that the scan has to interrogate and pull all the plugins out of it. Depending on your bundle of plugins this can sometimes take up to 5+ minutes but should only need to be done initially.

    I can assure that in a well maintained system both Waves and Arturia plugins should not cause KK to scan every time. If they do, you have an issue as above or similar.

  • stewart hannah
    stewart hannah Member Posts: 2 Noise
    edited January 30

    JesterMgee I can assure you my file folder system is well organised tidy and without any replication of dlls vst3 etc. Usually my systems works perfectly, if not I will make the effort to fix what is broken no matter what it takes or how long.

    So I uninstalled Waves Central, deleted all the various Waves folders and ran my Daw and then Kontrol worked perfectly no Waves, I installed Waves Central and no plugins no problem added a couple of plugins again no problem and then the rest with no issues !!

    The only change to my system since I had last used Kontrol was Kontrol had updated to a later version as had Waves Central but all the Waves plugins were the same. For all the Waves plugins I own I rarely now use them but then I could say that about most of what I own !!

    Coming from a IT background I try and store as little as possible on the root C:/drive so if I ever have to use system restore it only restores system and app executable files, I store all the other essential files on another drive v:\ using symlinks which works perfectly. I have two almost identical systems, one is a test slave backup the other is my main master everyday system both have same motherboard cpu and on board M2, only difference is the GPU and various storage hard drives both have full copies of all my soundbanks presets samples plugins and my Kontakt Libraries. The thought of downloading installing etc all those files is scary, I can sleep knowing if I lose a hard drive its no big deal. In this instance one worked fine the other not, so a reinstall was the first easy option Waves is a small app even with multiple plugins else I would have copied over files from one system to the other as this can also usually fix some issues.

  • JesterMgee
    JesterMgee Custom NKS Libraries: freelancesoundlabs.com/nksMember Posts: 386 Saw

    Ideally you should store your VST plugin on the C:\ drive and not use Symlinks. I know you "rarely" have issues but almost anyone (user, professional, developer etc...) will recommend to have a single fixed location in Program Files for your dll plugins, then install your library and content on a second drive.

    Remember Waves is an enigma, using the WaveShell and some weird way to enclose all the plugins within a single container. The VST scanner process a DAW uses may not correctly resolve that using a symlink so could be a cause of issue.

    If I were you I would move your VST library back to your C:\Program Files location just so you can be sure that is not part of the issue.

    All I can say is if things are all installed and working correct, there should be no issue as 99% of users don't see an issue.

    The thought of downloading installing etc all those files is scary, I can sleep knowing if I lose a hard drive its no big deal

    Well to give you the case of a nightmare, unless you are doing a full OS backup too then sorry to say, currently with NI content even if it is already installed in another location installing from scratch it will NOT detect installed content and have to download it all again anyway. Additionally every instrument needs to be installed again to install all your registry keys, licenses, iLok auth etc so you will be installing everything again anyway, it really doesn't save you much at all. Trust me, after a good 10 computer migrations and 25 years of this since 1995 I know this hassle all too well and the reason I have not updated my system or OS now in close to 10 years other than the migration from Win7 to 10 but I am due this headache this year.

  • Daniel
    Daniel Member Posts: 15 Sine

    What I do to use KK without the scanning process: I rename the "ScanApp" to "ScanApp_" … After KK won't recognize the ScanApp and will launch automatically without the scanning process.

    Here you find the Location for the ScanApp on your Mac:

    /Library/Application Support/Native Instruments/Komplete Kontrol/ScanApp.app

    There should be a similar path on Windows …

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